How Far Is Too Far?

[QueenLena03]

I have encountered a situation recently where a young woman feels pressured to remove her locs and proceed to get a perm and a weave in order to make herself more marketable in her field (consulting in the medical profession I believe). I know times are very hard and jobs are hard to come by but my question is where would you draw the line in terms of style choices for jobs. She was told that her look wasn't conservative enough by someone who was involved in some sort of way with an interview she had. Her locs are very small in size, barely shoulder length, and colored in a dark auburn. From a distance many would think she had braids. I spoke with her and she was very upset and torn about what to do. I know she was going on interviews over the past few months and nothing has been working out so she feels cornered in a way. My question to her was once you do get a perm and weave what if they still don't feel you are conservative enough? How far is too far to get a good job?

[~*welekevu*~]

Wow... on the one hand I'm like, you gotta feel for the sistah. She sounds like she's been looking for a while and feels that she's running out of options. But on the other hand, you're right, Lena, I mean, sacrificing who you are for a job still doesn't mean that you'll get it. In today's, yesterday's and tomorrow's societies black just isn't conserative enough, and the more "ethnic" (I hate that term :smug ) you look, the harder it is.
I recently quit my job because my employer seemed to have issues with my head wear (I wear Islamic hijab). I know I coulda sued her, but at that point I was just tired and lookin for a reason to quit.
I feel that for someone to have the audacity to tell a prospective employee that should be unconstitutional; she's not being hired for what she looks like (only in theory of course) but for her abilities. This is truly shameful. If I was her, I'd keep lookin and not give up and not give in even if it meant I had to take a less prestigious and/or career oriented job on the side to hold down the fort till I found a company that could appreciate me for who I am and what I can offer. But I know that is becoming exceedingly difficult in today's job market. All I can say is more power to the sistah, and I hope she doesn't lose herself in her search for a career position.

:thumbsup welekevu

[feepee]

i WOULD NOT relax my hair for a job. it seems she's in a difficult situation tho. if anything, if i were her (which i'm not) i'd consider chopping and wearing a twa.

the thing is, i've never been THAT far up the corporate ladder so i would even consider wearing a headwrap. that seems to be commonly accepted here in Minnesota where i live. i'd wear a headwrap for the interview. actually now that i think about it, i'd flat out ask the interviewer if my locs would be a problem with getting the job.

that way she's putting it back on them to make the decision if they will use hair (of all things) to be a factor in if they will hire a person.

[flybutter]

I interviewed a lady once who can in dressed just as professional as you could get plus she had some serious skills.

Needless to say, when it came to her day to day dressing, homegirl dressed to 2 inches shy of a hooker. Tehcnically she wasn't violating the dress code. Kinda like that character Kenny hired on "Soul Food".

I say if you really think that the hair is the problem, wear a wig, get the job and then come in with your locks. What can they do? If they fire you for exercising your rights to have style options, sue and never work again.

[QueenLena03]

Originally posted by flybutter@Sep 29 2004, 06:09 PM
I interviewed a lady once who can in dressed just as professional as you could get plus she had some serious skills.

Needless to say, when it came to her day to day dressing, homegirl dressed to 2 inches shy of a hooker. Tehcnically she wasn't violating the dress code. Kinda like that character Kenny hired on "Soul Food".

I say if you really think that the hair is the problem, wear a wig, get the job and then come in with your locks. What can they do? If they fire you for exercising your rights to have style options, sue and never work again.
Very smart flybutter. I'll tell her that! Thanks

[PrincessDrRe]

I do know this for fact. If she does relax her hair for a job, there will be no limit to the things she will end up giving up for this job. ...and they will always have the same answer back...

"You did this for us....why not this too.....???"

Stay true to self...even if she is unemployed for the time. A job that requires you to put Drano on your head ain't healthy no damn way.... :-cre

:blab to ya friend.

Out.

:tiptoe

[charli]

Well, I know I've said that I would relax for money. A LOT of money, but not for a job. I detest corporate america with all my might. I hate the pressure we put upon ourselves to assimilate into what we perceive are white people's standards of professionalism.

Me, I wouldn't give a flying flip about a job. Honestly. And I hated corporate america so much that I made a way out for myself where I don't have to do a damn thing to appease any interviewer or manager.

Having said that, the professional consulting field is very conservative. My friend used to work for a firm where men could not have beards, not even 3 day stubble. I think sometimes people have to consider whether they want to change for a job or find a different field that is less conservative about physical appearance.

[Me220]

Wow, that's rough. I just started my locs a few months ago, and I'm already too attached to them to let them go, so I know that's got to be hard. I'm also feeling her pain, because of the field I'm in. Which leads me to a question.

I am training to be an actor, theatre is where I want to spend my life. This profession all about how one looks, and people are told to remain fairly "neutral" (their term, not mine). So if how do people feel about that same situation, they ask her to perm her hair, but the job itself is dependant on the look?

I'm just asking to see what the thoughts are on it, because I've already decided that if they need me to change it, they can buy me a wig, but I know there are some performers out there who shy away from natural styles because they aren't "neutral" enough. I know I did for a long time.

[flybutter]

Okay Charli,

You've got a sistah curious over here. What do you do? If you don't want the world to know you can always PM me.

I'm real tired of the DL mess around here. I think I'm not getting the promotions and training I should because of my locks. Right now I don't care too much cause when I finish my degree (but that's still a couple years away) I'm out anyway. Or until I find a job I like that will pay for my schooling like this one does.

[LBellatrix]

I think the TWA and wig options are perfect. IDEALLY, though, she should keep looking until she finds a workplace that can handle her hair choice. I know that's easier said than done for someone who may be young and/or in need of cash, but ultimately it will be worth it.

I have said this repeatedly and I believe it with all my heart: You may have to change your hair STYLE for a job, but you don't have to change your hair TEXTURE for any job. I was in the professional consulting field (and the highest-ranking black female manager in my company at the time) when I did the BC. Technically I'm still in the professional consulting field, even though I'm freelance/independent contractor. So far I haven't had any problems with my loose hair or my (almost-year-old) locs.

I recently ran into a woman who I used to consider my unofficial mentor, mainly because she's black, older, and in the same field as me (technical writing/training development). She's starting locs with braids! I think she and I may have the same attitude: At this point, if someone's going to ignore all the job experience I have and focus on my hairstyle, they're not worth working for. But I (and she) can afford to say that, because we have the money and the experience. Someone younger might not be able to afford to say that.

At this point I would have to be one step from welfare/homelessness before I'd change my hair (cut locs, relaxed, etc.) for a job. The need for workers to conform to a uniform look is bullsh** and I'm so far beyond that kind of conformity.

[theomozo]

This is very interesting.

The reality is that locs, fros, and nappy hair in general are acceptable, even encouraged, in some professions. A nappy poet is da bomb. Picture a relaxed haired poet :huh You get the picture. In some other professions Napps are not welcome especially professions that are dominated by white folk (that would be a whole lotta professions).

This is one of the reasons why people start their own businesses. You would be amazed at how many of my clients started their own businesses because they did not want to have a dress code.

I am sorry your friend had to cut her locs. Like the others here, I would not cut my locs (if I had them) and would not advice anyone to do so either. This is our life and our destiny and we need to start breaking unfair unwritten rules, start making our own rules and start spreading those rules. Because until we have lots of Napps in the corporate world, making the rules we will continue to face the dilemma of whether we should "cut our locs and perm our hair".

All the best

[onyxspirals]

I think that the wig is a good idea. I can empathize with you. I am nappy and working through a temp agency. Two friends suggested that I may have to change my hair to get an interview. The first friend, a female, suggested that I press my hair. I've tried pressing just for a different look and it just puffs up so large that I have to wash it and go back to my puff or twists. The second friend, a male, didn't suggest a style, but suggested that the way that I look could be the reason that I haven't found a permanent job. I too am looking to start my own business. Not for the above reasons, but because I can't see myself making someone else rich for the rest of my life. Nuh uh. I think that you should look at other career options as some of the other posters stated and also, look at your financial situation. If your money is short, you can always temp, as I am. I have applied to a couple of the companies that I have worked at. Most recently, I declined a positon simply because there was no growth opportunity. The manager wanted me to apply, but I know that I would have been miserable event though it meant a steady paycheck. Think about what is most important to you. Weigh the pros and cons on a sheet of paper. This will help you to decide what you should do.
~blakbutafli

[Mollyright]

She might simply need to dye her hair a natural color. Its to much at once. I had cornrows at job which was fine I never felt there was any discontent from my boss but if I had shown up to work with burgandy braids with zig-zag parts that would have been to much. So my suggestion is to keep it classic at work and she might not run into to much opposition.

[tjolims]

Originally posted by Me220@Oct 12 2004, 10:42 PM
I am training to be an actor, theatre is where I want to spend my life. This profession all about how one looks, and people are told to remain fairly "neutral" (their term, not mine). So if how do people feel about that same situation, they ask her to perm her hair, but the job itself is dependant on the look?
Yeah, they tell you that, but when you think of the top five black female movie actors from 1970-now...Whoopi Goldberg, Halle Berry, Cicely Tyson, Angela Bassett and Diana Ross(sad but true)...the only "neutral" looking one is Halle, IMO.

[Nubian21]

I work at a University is African Centered, so having natural hair is gladly accepted. When I first started transitioning, my girl in the office was so excited and so were some of my fellow co-workers. :D My mom said that I should be happy that i work here because it may not be accepted somewhere else :angry: I have a job interview in about a week and my mom asked was I going to buy a wig, my response was HELL NO!! It is truly a shame that you cannot just be accepted for who you are, and that you have to bend over backwards and jump hurdles for acceptance.

[blumoonbabe]

Well just call me a hard headed pain in the ***, because I ain't changing jack about my hair to get or keep ANYONE's job. Period. I don't even have anything else to say about the matter. If the people I work with/around are petty enough to think of my hair as a potential distraction, then I don't want any parts of that job.

[Nappilocs]

I wouldn't want to work for that type of company. The fact that they had a problem with my natural hair is indicative of the environment. I would be bitter walking in the door. I know times are hard but I would have to tell them to take thier job and shove it. I might even get the media involved because it sounds like discrimation...

[wildduro]

Thanks so much for this topic! I graduate in May 05, and I've been natural since high school. I had this convo w/ a few of my friends who are also natural, just the other day. :)
...I might have to get a wig :unsure:

[Geminibrown78]

I am so sorry to hear of your friend. I don't understand what it is about corporate America. My BF and I had an argument about me now being able to find a new job. He said that it is because of my hair that no one wants to hire me :Angry_boese008: He has a lot of family that works in human resources and says that hiring managers are not looking for somethin exotic that's gonna make distractions, they want someone "safe". You already have to do enough tap-dancing to get through an interview, shouldn't have to cmpromise yourself too.

[Tumbles]

I have to admit that when I interviewed for the job that I have now, I did wear a wig. At the time, I had just decided that week to leave my extensions out and go all out with wearing a fro or twisties. The night before the interview I washed my hair, and then the next morning, I was feeling down because I couldn't get "the look" I wanted. I just slapped my wig on (praying my nappy hair didn't want to come out from under the wig at some point and say hello :D

After the interview I came home and took the wig off and went on about my business! I did get the job, and I do wonder if I would've got the job without the wig. But now I wear twisties, afro, extensions, WHATEVER, and nobody seems to care, at least they haven't said anything to my face.

[AfroPuff]

Very interesting topic. I've seen this discussed in other forums on this site. I'm going to watch this one.

I'm at a crossroads with my hair and I'm either going to loc it or cut it back down to the TWA. My hair is a lot to manage and I've got 2 young kids so time is of the essence.

I really want the locs, but I too have wondered how it may limit future job opportunities. I work for a Black Owned firm right now, so there hasn't been an issue with my twists, twist-outs, and Big-A afros.

It is truly ashame that we Black women have to go thru this drama. I agree with LBellatrix that we should not have to change the texture of our hair for anybody.

[tran68]

I have to admit that if a client is coming in I will opt for a more conservative style like a high neatly compacted puff or brushed back into a low bun. I would not do the wild and HUGE twist-out I'm sporting today. :P Now if someone just shows up then come what may because I can't do anything about it, but if I know in advance a client is coming in, I'll tone my hair down that day. I find that my big hair is a bit distractive and it's annoying during the whole meeting that they're looking at my hair and not me.

I would never perm it or weave it, not an option :angry:

[zenvodunista]

Originally posted by wildduro@Dec 31 2004, 06:08 PM
Thanks so much for this topic! I graduate in May 05, and I've been natural since high school. I had this convo w/ a few of my friends who are also natural, just the other day. :)
...I might have to get a wig :unsure:

660416


nah, i've been natural since i was 16 and i'm 32 now. i've attended two ivy league universityies and worked for big name folks and the like, most of the time with dreads or a twa. don't get a wig. you'll be fine :)

n.