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awren
02-01-2005, 02:39 PM
When did the black man become the universal 'dawg'? Lazy, shiftless, undermotivated, underpaid, etc? To look at the media images and read some threads, black men have been reduced to womanizing baby daddy's with nothing to offer except 20 minutes of heat and friction, or he's that 'down-low brotha' who is out there spreading STDs.

These are overgeneralizations, but the perception is out there. How real is that percepetion? How does that negative perception impact black women, if at all?

I come in contact with a lot of black men: married or single, being good dads, good brothers, good friends, good people. I'd like to see the tarnished image of black men replaced with the reality that there are still a lot of good black men out there.

Much love to all my black brothers who are out there taking care of business and creating positivity to those whose lives they touch :wub:

tran68
02-01-2005, 03:00 PM
I'm angry at Essence and other black magazines who make it a POINT to write article after article and cover after cover on the DL black brothers, the incarcerated black brothers, the baby daddy 5 times ova black brothers, and maybe ONE positive article on black men the entire year. :angry: ....WE DO IT TO OURSELVES, it's homemade and homegrown, can't blame YT for this one! :icon_headshake: Thing is talkin bout positive black men is not an interesting conversation starter, nor interesting news....folk love the shocking and the shameful and if Essence and other mags didn't have an audience for all these articles they sure as hell wouldn't write em.

ChocoMom
02-01-2005, 05:21 PM
Black men are dogs. Black men are either in jail, on probation, got 6 kids by four different women, on the dl, yadda, yadda, yadda :rolleyes:

All lies that we as black people do to ourselves, then the media picks it up and runs with it and we want to complain.

Black men are much maligned but I still love you :wub: Tall short, red boned, black as midnight, baller, or suit and tie-I still love ya :hug:

honeychild
02-01-2005, 05:28 PM
you never hear about most good stuff that happens in the world, if you look to the media for it. what's considered 'news' is usually 'bad news' ... sensational... shocking, etc.

just pay closer attention to the men you know who are normal human beings; and less to the blown-up images of men we'll never meet.

Dolliesdaughter
02-01-2005, 05:29 PM
It is a shame that this poison is spread, but a lot of it is spread by our own people. The woman who was dogged over, the DL lover who was hurt. I know that there are good black men but the media chooses to pick up on the bad ones instead of the good ones, that sometimes is the only one that people want to recognize. We need to recognize our good brothers and sisters because according to the media some of use are only good for breeding but then again we only breed trash. :doh

Black is beautiful, black is smart and black is great.

NLight1
02-01-2005, 07:07 PM
I agree, we often spread this posion about ourselves. Or even worse, live up to the expectation and perpetuate the image ourselves. Of course there are just as many trifling sisters as there are brothas. But unfortunately, the brothas are getting a much harsher rap than we are. I agree with the sista that said pay more attention to the actual men in our lives and not worry about the celebrities, politicians, or so called leaders. Pay attention to the brothers in our communities and try to promote as much positivity and encouragement as we can.

curvycurly78
02-01-2005, 11:47 PM
DISCLAIMER: This does not apply to ALL black men, I suppose there are some of them somewhere... I know this will cause backlash but oh well, what's life without opposition, right?

I can only speak for myself...I have NEVER witnessed a "good black man" . And by that I'm speaking about mean I've dealt with as well as men every woman I know has dealt with. My definition has nothing to do with how many kids he has but rather how he takes care of those kids, not how much money he makes but the fact that he is not looking for a woman to "carry" him and knowing what needs to be done if he doesn't like his current financial situation. I have yet to meet a black woman dealing with a black man that wasn't at some point sharing him with another woman (either knowingly or unknowingly). Once again, I'll reiterate, I am not generalizing as I have not met every black man on the planet, but I go with what I know...And I feel the only way black men can get past the stereotypes is to show and prove. Black men are let off the hook so easily and its sad. They think that if they do one thing right (for example, paying child support) now that makes them a good man-WRONG!!!!! Being a good black man is a combination of things and no one can tell a man how to be a man. A real man doesn't need to be told. Either you are or you arent. PERIOD. Just my :2cents: I digress.

honeychild
02-02-2005, 02:40 AM
Originally posted by curvycurly78@Feb 1 2005, 07:47 PM
I go with what I know...And I feel the only way black men can get past the stereotypes is to show and prove.

698888


this is definitely true. individuals need to take responsibility for their actions and create new experiences in the world, that will resonate enough so that people start talking as much about 'good'ness as they do abt 'bad'ness

and i appreciate your constant disclaimers and reluctance to generalize.

that's why i didn't respond with 'yeah, black men are all wonderful, so THERE, media.' i do think the media tends to sensationalize and is quicker to report wack behavior, but that doesn't mean there aren't brothers out there doing dirt.

it's been MY experience, however, that black men are some incredible creatures: intelligent, responsible, mentally flexible, funny, creative, strong, protective, giving, vulnerable, and generous.

it's also my experience that black women are the BOMB, too -- supportive, communicative, trustworthy, and helpful; which also flies in the face of stereotypical wisdom.

i have been blessed to exist in and cultivate friendships within a circle of truly lovely people. sure, they have flaws and make mistakes, but so do i. ;)

LifeGiver
02-02-2005, 03:40 AM
Originally posted by curvycurly78@Feb 1 2005, 11:47 PM
DISCLAIMER: This does not apply to ALL black men, I suppose there are some of them somewhere... I know this will cause backlash but oh well, what's life without opposition, right?

I can only speak for myself...I have NEVER witnessed a "good black man" . And by that I'm speaking about mean I've dealt with as well as men every woman I know has dealt with. My definition has nothing to do with how many kids he has but rather how he takes care of those kids, not how much money he makes but the fact that he is not looking for a woman to "carry" him and knowing what needs to be done if he doesn't like his current financial situation. I have yet to meet a black woman dealing with a black man that wasn't at some point sharing him with another woman (either knowingly or unknowingly). Once again, I'll reiterate, I am not generalizing as I have not met every black man on the planet, but I go with what I know...And I feel the only way black men can get past the stereotypes is to show and prove. Black men are let off the hook so easily and its sad. They think that if they do one thing right (for example, paying child support) now that makes them a good man-WRONG!!!!! Being a good black man is a combination of things and no one can tell a man how to be a man. A real man doesn't need to be told. Either you are or you arent. PERIOD. Just my :2cents: I digress.

698888



I'm sorry that you have not YET had the priviledge of knowing/ loving/ being loved by a good Black man because it TRULY is an honor. Just like being loved by a good Black woman is an honor. Every Black women needs to know a good Black man and not necessarily as a lover but just as a friend.


Another man can tell/ teach a man how to be a man.

And good men are cultivated. We say we can't tell a man how to be a man but women consult/ listen to all types of resources about how to be a woman. Magazines/ the media/ your girlfriends/ your mama/ the classic examples of how NOT to be etc... Everybody needs an example and help showing them the way. Every man has the potential to be a dog (to somebody) just like every woman has the capacity to be a female one.

caraqueen
02-02-2005, 04:21 AM
More negative imagery perpetuated by stereotyping, bigotry and ignorance..I believe half of what I see and none of what I hear. I meet beautiful black people every day male and female that prove all of that crap wrong.....by no means are they perfect but they are becoming part of the solution rather than the problem. :wub:

awren
02-02-2005, 09:07 AM
Can I really post here now?????

YIPEE!!!


:blush: Sorry, carry on......

ScoobyGurl
02-02-2005, 01:25 PM
I think we need to be just and balanced in our view of black men. Yeah, there are plenty of good black men but there are plenty of dawgs as well and I've had my experiences with both. I'll defend the good brothas and I would never generalize about black men because I sure as hell don't like when people generalize about black women. However, perhaps some of those generalizations exist because many black men need to work on some major issues. So many black men are misogynistic towards women. This misogyny plays its out with the father who jets on his baby's momma, the majority of rappers who think that women are disposable sex toys and simply the caregiver of their children, the black men who still think that we're suppose to tend to their every little whim w/o thinking of ourselves, and even the fact that there are threads like this saying "support black men." I'm always seeing stories on how we need to bring up the black male, how black men are being put down. We're expected to do so much for black men. I just wish someone besides black women were sticking up for black women. Even in the book store, you'll be sure to see more than one book by both sistahs and brothas defending black men. Yet I only saw one book by a brotha defending sistahs. I won't generalize about black men but at the same time they have to defend their image and prove the stereotypes just the way that we do. They're responsible for proving the myths wrong not us.

ScoobyGurl
02-04-2005, 02:15 PM
bump

sonce
02-04-2005, 04:13 PM
Originally posted by ScoobyGurl@Feb 2 2005, 01:25 PM
I think we need to be just and balanced in our view of black men. Yeah, there are plenty of good black men but there are plenty of dawgs as well and I've had my experiences with both. I'll defend the good brothas and I would never generalize about black men because I sure as hell don't like when people generalize about black women. However, perhaps some of those generalizations exist because many black men need to work on some major issues. So many black men are misogynistic towards women. This misogyny plays its out with the father who jets on his baby's momma, the majority of rappers who think that women are disposable sex toys and simply the caregiver of their children, the black men who still think that we're suppose to tend to their every little whim w/o thinking of ourselves, and even the fact that there are threads like this saying "support black men." I'm always seeing stories on how we need to bring up the black male, how black men are being put down. We're expected to do so much for black men. I just wish someone besides black women were sticking up for black women. Even in the book store, you'll be sure to see more than one book by both sistahs and brothas defending black men. Yet I only saw one book by a brotha defending sistahs. I won't generalize about black men but at the same time they have to defend their image and prove the stereotypes just the way that we do. They're responsible for proving the myths wrong not us.

699416


:smil3f72836ee752e: :smil3f72836ee752e: :smil3f72836ee752e: :smil3f72836ee752e: :smil3f72836ee752e: :smil3f72836ee752e: :smil3f72836ee752e: :smil3f72836ee752e: :smil3f72836ee752e:

Denny
02-04-2005, 04:55 PM
Most black men are raised by women what happens in the home is VERY important and mothers it does not help to stand by your son when he is treating another woman's daughter or son badly. And yes the media does stereotype the black men in a negative way but they are not social workers and as we know bad news and sex sells if no one was buying the books/papers or listening to the programmes they would not show it.

Adonna
02-04-2005, 09:01 PM
Young black men are satisfied to eat at McDonald's and sleep with white women. That's their idea of overcoming. As long as they're satisfied with that, there will be no change. Their reputation is well earned.

animeg
02-05-2005, 01:15 AM
I have seen many good black men- my family is filled with them. Not to mention, in my university, I see black men striving and working. Out in the community, I see black men volunteering. Of course everyone wants to talk about drama, but at the end of the day, it's all good.

honeychild
02-05-2005, 02:02 AM
speak it, scooby!

Sweet Epiphany
02-05-2005, 01:42 PM
Originally posted by ScoobyGurl@Feb 2 2005, 01:25 PM
I think we need to be just and balanced in our view of black men. Yeah, there are plenty of good black men but there are plenty of dawgs as well and I've had my experiences with both. I'll defend the good brothas and I would never generalize about black men because I sure as hell don't like when people generalize about black women. However, perhaps some of those generalizations exist because many black men need to work on some major issues. So many black men are misogynistic towards women. This misogyny plays its out with the father who jets on his baby's momma, the majority of rappers who think that women are disposable sex toys and simply the caregiver of their children, the black men who still think that we're suppose to tend to their every little whim w/o thinking of ourselves, and even the fact that there are threads like this saying "support black men." I'm always seeing stories on how we need to bring up the black male, how black men are being put down. We're expected to do so much for black men. I just wish someone besides black women were sticking up for black women. Even in the book store, you'll be sure to see more than one book by both sistahs and brothas defending black men. Yet I only saw one book by a brotha defending sistahs. I won't generalize about black men but at the same time they have to defend their image and prove the stereotypes just the way that we do. They're responsible for proving the myths wrong not us.
699416


Basics. You have summed up my exact feelings and approach to a tee. There needs to be a delicate balance of loving and appreciate black men, but at the same time, holding them accountable to the very same sexism that they project onto black women as a means to subvert their own oppression from the white supremacist capitalist patriarchal discourse. I know that I personally loveblack men enough to do so. It doesn't have to be so either/or. To solely male bash is completely unecessary. But to defend and protect them even in the event of abuse, assault and just downright disrespect for instance serves just as much as a disservice to them in my opinion.

brnize4u
02-05-2005, 03:58 PM
I agree wholeheartedly with ScoobyGurl. When are our black men going to STEP UP. There are black men out there who do what they're supposed to do. They are out there struggling with two and three jobs to take care of their kids and families. I know because my father was a good man who took care of his family. My father wasn't perfect...being an afterwork alcoholic but he was there taking care of home. The media wouldn't talk about our black men if there were taking care of their responsibilities...ie..planting their sperm into any woman that will look at him. I'm sorry because this subject gets me so upset.

brnize4u :angry:

ScoobyGurl
02-05-2005, 04:37 PM
Originally posted by Adonna@Feb 4 2005, 04:01 PM
Young black men are satisfied to eat at McDonald's and sleep with white women. That's their idea of overcoming. As long as they're satisfied with that, there will be no change. Their reputation is well earned.

703694


Generalizing always helps a problem doesn&#39;t it? :rolleyes: <_<

growunatty
02-05-2005, 04:43 PM
http://www.ferris.edu/news/jimcrow/menu.htm

there are links towards the bottom of the page that deal with stereotypes of black men (women and children) and the history behind them.

i&#39;m scared to enter this conversation. some of y&#39;all are saying some off the wall ish.

ScoobyGurl
02-05-2005, 05:23 PM
Originally posted by growunatty@Feb 5 2005, 11:43 AM
http://www.ferris.edu/news/jimcrow/menu.htm

there are links towards the bottom of the page that deal with stereotypes of black men (women and children) and the history behind them.

i&#39;m scared to enter this conversation. some of y&#39;all are saying some off the wall ish.

704704


Change starts with the exchange of ideas ;) .

honeychild
02-05-2005, 05:37 PM
Originally posted by Sweet Epiphany@Feb 5 2005, 09:42 AM
Basics. You have summed up my exact feelings and approach to a tee. There needs to be a delicate balance of loving and appreciate black men, but at the same time, holding them accountable to the very same sexism that they project onto black women as a means to subvert their own oppression from the white supremacist capitalist patriarchal discourse. I know that I personally loveblack men enough to do so. It doesn&#39;t have to be so either/or. To solely male bash is completely unecessary. But to defend and protect them even in the event of abuse, assault and just downright disrespect for instance serves just as much as a disservice to them in my opinion.

704568



PREACH it, sis. yes, yes, yes.

caraqueen
02-05-2005, 08:32 PM
I agree in general there is not much support for sisters from black men and that it would be nice to have some balance ..I have met some good black men but my everyday experience is that walking down the street I am going to run into twice the amount of negativity then positivity . It is hard for both black women and black men, but we have been holding up the banner for them and I don&#39;t see enough of the same.