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psalm34
03-06-2008, 12:24 PM
The question they kept batting around on MSNBC this morning was what about Obama and Hillary in a prez/ VP ticket? I don't like the idea at all! I would think that Hillary wouldn't go for it because of her own ego but some people will do anything to win and she wants it bad. On the other hand, I can't imagine that Obama would want to be VP, especially not to Hillary or "Billary" because he would have to but up with Bill in addition to all of her deviousness. It would also seem so contradictory if either of them did it considering the criticisms on both sides - but it happens all of the time in Presidential elections.

If it came down to it, how would you feel? or vote? Would you lose respect for Obama?

Alastri
03-06-2008, 12:27 PM
If Hillary got the nomination and Obama was her VP, I would definitely vote for her. I plan on voting for Obama, and his VP isn't going to change my mind. So..eh, I guess I don't really care. I prefer Obama as president though.

BrnNappyGrl
03-06-2008, 12:47 PM
I don't see it happening simply because Michelle ain't havin' it. Not after the way the swamp thing spoke on and treated her husband. Heck no.

I'd vote republican before I'd vote Illary Clinton.

That's just what it is.

Loquacious
03-06-2008, 01:15 PM
I thought they should've been on the same ticket from the jump. Two strong democrats isn't going to do anything but split the democratic votes down the middle thus, allowing the republicans a chance to profit from our infighting. I thought that way all the way up until Hil started fighting dirty and I wondered if she had any sense at all. You don't kick dirt on the people on your side, stupidazz!

napturallyme
03-06-2008, 01:18 PM
A big fat NO for me


I don't think it could ever work. I definitely don't want her on the top of the ticket and her ego is too big to be a VP. She and Bill would still try to run the White House. She and Barack just don't seem to have that kinda relationship where they can work together to me.


I also think Hillary being on the ticket in any capacity will make it really tough for the Dems to win back the White House.

Now she seems to be all for the ticket thing, but seems to be she thinks she should be the one on the top of it. As evidenced with her arrogant comment "OH thinks I should be on the top of that ticket too". Gimme a friggin break, that's one freaking state, look at all the states Obama won.

GalaxyGirl2012
03-06-2008, 02:18 PM
A big fat NO for me
I don't think it could ever work. I definitely don't want her on the top of the ticket and her ego is too big to be a VP. She and Bill would still try to run the White House. She and Barack just don't seem to have that kinda relationship where they can work together to me.
I also think Hillary being on the ticket in any capacity will make it really tough for the Dems to win back the White House.

Now she seems to be all for the ticket thing, but seems to be she thinks she should be the one on the top of it. As evidenced with her arrogant comment "OH thinks I should be on the top of that ticket too". Gimme a friggin break, that's one freaking state, look at all the states Obama won.
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correct if i'm wrong, but ohio pretty much decided the election for bush in the last election. one state of florida pretty much determined the election for bush in 2000. so yes, 1 large state with alot of electoral votes can make a huge difference.

the issue in the general election isn't number of states, or number of people voting for a particular candidate. it's the electoral votes. a candidate needs 270 electoral votes to win the presidency, and if someone can't get the majority of votes in more than one of these states : california, florida, illinois, new york, ohio, pennsylvania and texas. then they won't win the election.


as for obama/clinton ticket i think it&#39;s too late for that especially on her end. she&#39;s already said that her potential running mate wasn&#39;t fit for office <_< that&#39;s just stupid. one of the problems with her is that she opens her pie-hole before thinking about the consequences of what she&#39;s saying. i can understand living in the moment, but going from "obama wouldnt be good in the white house" to "yeah i&#39;m up for a a joint ticket let&#39;s just decide who&#39;s on top" within 24 hours is just dumb

my hope is that obama wins the nominations and chooses someone else as his running mate.

GalaxyGirl2012
03-06-2008, 03:20 PM
democratic voter turnout and people voting for a democratic candidate are not necessarily the same thing. many of these primaries were open which means that we can&#39;t just make the assumption that just because someone voted for a democratic candidate that they are either democrat or planning on voting democratic in the general election.

there are many reports around the nation of republicans voting for a democratic candidate just to block the other one from getting the nomination. so basically let&#39;s not count those chickens that might not even be in our basket.

snicy
03-06-2008, 03:34 PM
At first I did think that an Obama/Clinton ticket would be a sure bet especially since I think people are pretty sick of the Republicans. However, I honestly think that Billary burned that bridge after she:
1) said that he was inexperienced
2) pressed the whole Rezko thing
3) basically endorsed McCain.

She&#39;s so focused on getting back into the White House that she clearly didn&#39;t even entertain the possibility that it might not happen. This scorched earth route is only going to hurt her in the end. :rolleyes:

China
03-06-2008, 03:40 PM
democratic voter turnout and people voting for a democratic candidate are not necessarily the same thing. many of these primaries were open which means that we can&#39;t just make the assumption that just because someone voted for a democratic candidate that they are either democrat or planning on voting democratic in the general election.

there are many reports around the nation of republicans voting for a democratic candidate just to block the other one from getting the nomination. so basically let&#39;s not count those chickens that might not even be in our basket.
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Yeah, but the numbers havent been large enough (# of Republicans voting with ulterior motives) to be a real issue. For example, many of them have urged to vote for Clinton (since she&#39;s easier to defeat supposedly) yet Obama still got the majority of Republican votes in TX and other states. I think many of them are just sick and tired of either the war in Iraq, the state of our economy, or both.

psalm34
03-06-2008, 03:49 PM
one of the problems with her is that she opens her pie-hole before thinking about the consequences of what she&#39;s saying. i can understand living in the moment, but going from "obama wouldnt be good in the white house" to "yeah i&#39;m up for a a joint ticket let&#39;s just decide who&#39;s on top" within 24 hours is just dumb

my hope is that obama wins the nominations and chooses someone else as his running mate.
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^^^ITA

Karibana
03-06-2008, 04:15 PM
Humm, had Hillary not run such a negative campaign, I&#39;d say yes but she has pissed enough people who would stay home rather then vote for her even if that means the republicans would be back in office.

Personally, I think that an Obama/John Edward ticket would probably be the best. Or, he could find a GOP member that could help him against a moderate like McCain. Sure there are republicans that are unhappy that he has won but they are more disciplined then dems are are more likely to vote for the party no matter who&#39;s in charge.

PrincessDrRe
03-06-2008, 05:13 PM
I don&#39;t see it happening simply because Michelle ain&#39;t havin&#39; it. Not after the way the swamp thing spoke on and treated her husband. Heck no.

I&#39;d vote republican before I&#39;d vote Illary Clinton.

That&#39;s just what it is.
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That&#39;s it in a nutshell.....pernt blank.

Serbbral
03-06-2008, 05:44 PM
I&#39;ve been reading a lot of messages from Clinton backers who said that they would vote for McCain if Obama wins. So, I&#39;m thinking more and more that McCain is going to be our man.

Lady-N-Black
03-06-2008, 05:57 PM
I don&#39;t see it happening simply because Michelle ain&#39;t havin&#39; it. Not after the way the swamp thing spoke on and treated her husband. Heck no.

I&#39;d vote republican before I&#39;d vote Illary Clinton.

That&#39;s just what it is.
[/b]

Are you serious? Are you serious? You understand you just said you would be voting for John McCain if Obama lost, Why? I mean Hillary is crappy but McCain is a ruthless immoral war-monger. What is your reasoning for wanting him specifically in office over Hillary.

Don&#39;t get me wrong, I don&#39;t like the woman and I&#39;m pro-Obama like the day is long; BUT if it came down to it I believe with Hillary I&#39;d at least get SOMETHING. Me as a young black gay woman would stand to at least get the measely table scraps of human rights with Hillary before John McCain.

You might know something I don&#39;t, I don&#39;t know.

deecoily
03-06-2008, 06:03 PM
I&#39;d prefer an Obama / Bloomberg ticket.

napturallyme
03-06-2008, 06:22 PM
Once again heffa said today that she and McCain had national security experience and we will have to ask Barack what he has. How in the heck can she talk party unity after this is all over when she is smearing him like this. She might as well try to be McCain&#39;s VP as somebody on MSNBC suggested today (I think it was Chris Matthews)

BrnNappyGrl
03-06-2008, 06:25 PM
Are you serious? Are you serious? You understand you just said you would be voting for John McCain if Obama lost, Why? I mean Hillary is crappy but McCain is a ruthless immoral war-monger. What is your reasoning for wanting him specifically in office over Hillary.

Don&#39;t get me wrong, I don&#39;t like the woman and I&#39;m pro-Obama like the day is long; BUT if it came down to it I believe with Hillary I&#39;d at least get SOMETHING. Me as a young black gay woman would stand to at least get the measely table scraps of human rights with Hillary before John McCain.

You might know something I don&#39;t, I don&#39;t know.
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I understand perfectly well what I said. I said that I would put John McCain (who I can at least respect a little bit) in office versus Illary Clinton (whom I have neither liking nor respect for). I did not say that I wanted him in office. I simply said I would vote for him before I would vote for Illary. There is a difference.

http://www.theroot.com/id/45135 This article pretty much sums up my dislike and distrust of Illary Clinton. And please don&#39;t be so sure that you&#39;ll get any scraps off her human rights table. Remember, her husband is the one who passed the "Don&#39;t Ask, Don&#39;t Tell" policy that governs attitudes towards gays in the military to this day. That is not a human rights achievement.

What I know is that Illary has enough scandals (Whitewater and there is some indication that there will be another, even more damaging investigation coming down the pipe), slander (the Obama in a turban picture) and deliberate secrecy (only releasing parts of her taxes while the other candidates have released all of theirs lets me know that something in the milk ain&#39;t exactly clean) that I am uncomfortable putting the woman in the highest elected post in the land.





Once again heffa said today that she and McCain had national security experience and we will have to ask Barack what he has. How in the heck can she talk party unity after this is all over when she is smearing him like this. She might as well try to be McCain&#39;s VP as somebody on MSNBC suggested today (I think it was Chris Matthews)
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Please let her continue to talk. She&#39;s going to talk her way into loosing every last superdelegate that&#39;s left out there to grab.

Lady-N-Black
03-06-2008, 06:32 PM
I did not say that I wanted him in office. I simply said I would vote for him before I would vote for Illary. There is a difference.
http://www.theroot.com/id/45135 This article pretty much sums up my dislike and distrust of Illary Clinton. And please don&#39;t be so sure that you&#39;ll get any scraps off her human rights table. Remember, her husband is the one who passed the "Don&#39;t Ask, Don&#39;t Tell" policy that governs attitudes towards gays in the military to this day. That is not a human rights achievement.
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Understand I know very well who Hillary Clinton is and what kinda underhanded isht she pulls.

Understand I never even hinted that she had any "human rights achievements" as you have inferred by the bolded.

What I don&#39;t understand is why you prefer McCain over her. We all know she is bad, we all know we want Obama, we all know we would be miserable with her as our choice.

Thats not what I&#39;m asking.

I would like to know what specifically about McCains character and past record make him more trustworthy than Hillary? What makes you think that he would deliver more favorably than Hillary? What is it about him that you prefer over her? This isn&#39;t directed solely at you but everyone that said they&#39;d vote for McCain over Hillary.

Sacral
03-06-2008, 06:40 PM
What I wrote about this question in Dee&#39;s thread Obamans, Who Will You Vote For In November? (http://www.nappturality.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=114342)


Well, as you know I&#39;m voting for the Democratic Party period, but I sure hope Obama doesn&#39;t accept her offer.

I know he just won&#39;t be respected and overall treated very well as VP under Hillary.

It happened to Gore. If you carefully read this book excerpt in the November 2007 issue of Vanity Fair White House Civil War: Politics and Power - The Clintons (http://www.vanityfair.com/politics/features/2007/11/clinton200711?currentPage=1), you will see why. This was excerpted from " For Love of Politics—Bill and Hillary Clinton: The White House Years", by Sally Bedell Smith.

Most of what this book excerpt says is pretty much......True. Don&#39;t ask me how I know &#39;cause I ain&#39;t tellin&#39;

The highest levels of politics is pretty cerebral. It&#39;s a mixture of academics from all fields; what&#39;s called "political science" that includes history, polls, gambles, etc...., the will and drive along with a good ego to run for office and win, and just plain strategy. Sometimes those who plan ahead years in advance can win. Others.....Well the universe literally votes for them (some say this about Bill Clinton. This is definitely the case with Obama). No one wins without picking the right people to get them there.

In my opinion, Obama should wait for the next time if he doesn&#39;t get the nomination for President this time. He&#39;s young. VP is a insult for a man of his talent.

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GalaxyGirl2012
03-06-2008, 06:53 PM
Are you serious? Are you serious? You understand you just said you would be voting for John McCain if Obama lost, Why? I mean Hillary is crappy but McCain is a ruthless immoral war-monger. What is your reasoning for wanting him specifically in office over Hillary.

[/b]
i don&#39;t understand this either. i love how many polarized people who call themselves democrats are threatening to vote mccain if there candidate doesn&#39;t win. it just goes to show me that it&#39;s not the issues that people care about but the personalities of the people involved.

so when all of these people who chose to spite faces to take the "high" moral ground of blocking the other person from winning (just cus they don&#39;t personally like the other candidate who has 95% of the same platform as the candidate they claim to love so much), i hope that they have the good sense to not complain about how their jobs are continuing to be shipped overseas; how their husbands, sons, wives, cousins etc are forced into several tours of duty; how a military draft was started; how they are having to suffer during a recession with high oil prices, high food prices; how they are helping pass on trillions of dollars of national debt onto their kids and grandchildren all because they voted for mccain just to keep obama or hillary out of office.

that type of reasoning is like rioters and looters who tear up their own neighborhoods and burn their own buildings and then get pissy after the fact because the government isn&#39;t quick to hand them money to help fix what they themselves destroyed.

BrnNappyGrl
03-06-2008, 06:59 PM
ETA: Not even worth answering anymore.

Lady-N-Black
03-06-2008, 07:09 PM
that type of reasoning is like rioters and looters who tear up their own neighborhoods and burn their own buildings and then get pissy after the fact because the government isn&#39;t quick to hand them money to help fix what they themselves destroyed.
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Girl, you betta stop getting me so excited over her with your literary eloquence and fluid truth telling in general :P

I agree with EVERYTHING you said. I mean, the question of if we like Hillary or not has already been beat into the ground. We don&#39;t. But if a Hillary Vs. McCain ticket were to arise (as it possibly could) I&#39;m gonna pour a sip on the ground for my man Obama and happily cast my vote for Mrs. Clinton, wit my bad self.

No, I don&#39;t trust her, Hell no I don&#39;t like her! But God knows if its her against an old haughty blood thirsty McCain then imma endorse her.



ETA: Not even worth answering anymore.
[/b]


Let me first say I&#39;m not trying to disrespect you at all. Not at all.

But honestly you never did answer the question.

The question was for you to expand on your choice for endorsing McCain over Hillary. While you spoke on why you disliked and distrusted Hillary you never spoke on McCain. Yes, you mentioned you had a little respect for him; but you didn&#39;t tell us anything about him that made you like him over her.

Scribetastic
03-06-2008, 07:52 PM
That was my dream ticket at the start of all of this. I see it as potentially a 16 year lock on the executive office if Obama maintains his rep while Hillary is president (and that&#39;s assuming Hillary can take two terms back to back.)

I&#39;d vote for them for sure. However, now I think Hillary is so hated that it might work to sink them.

We&#39;ll see if Obama has what it takes to carry them all the way &#39;cause I don&#39;t think she does.

Alastri
03-06-2008, 08:03 PM
^^Thats what I was hoping for too :( Until I found Kucinich, but anyways...

Miss Nicole P, please reply. I get my political knowledge from reading NP. It&#39;s way too boring to do for extended periods elsewhere. Yay for learning, right? ^_^ I hate McCain, but maybe you can give us a reason not to?

pisces33
03-07-2008, 12:08 AM
so when all of these people who chose to spite faces to take the "high" moral ground of blocking the other person from winning (just cus they don&#39;t personally like the other candidate who has 95% of the same platform as the candidate they claim to love so much), i hope that they have the good sense to not complain about how their jobs are continuing to be shipped overseas; how their husbands, sons, wives, cousins etc are forced into several tours of duty; how a military draft was started; how they are having to suffer during a recession with high oil prices, high food prices; how they are helping pass on trillions of dollars of national debt onto their kids and grandchildren all because they voted for mccain just to keep obama or hillary out of office.
[/b]

And there it is. That&#39;s enough for me NOT to want to put &#39;Mad Dog" in office.

GalaxyGirl2012
03-07-2008, 03:30 AM
^^Thats what I was hoping for too :( Until I found Kucinich, but anyways...

Miss Nicole P, please reply. I get my political knowledge from reading NP. It&#39;s way too boring to do for extended periods elsewhere. Yay for learning, right? ^_^ I hate McCain, but maybe you can give us a reason not to?
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i can&#39;t answer for miss nicole P without her telling me to meet her on the corner of 81st and king :P

but i can understand why some people would be OK with voting mccain if they

1. are pro life
2. are concerned about al-quaeda in iraq, iran and other places.
3. trust someone who&#39;s has tested policies in dealing with illegal immigration
4. are upper middle class or wealthy and have gotten used to being tax exempt and legitimately believe that it will eventually help stimulate the economy and grow jobs.
5. want to keep dont ask don&#39;t tell in the military
6. believe that same sex marriage bans should be left to states
7. are pro-death penalty
8. are ok with helping china build it&#39;s economy in the hopes that it will overturn communism

gigglezk
03-07-2008, 04:18 AM
So what makes everyone (in general) think that Hillary is better than McCain? As for me, I&#39;ve said I&#39;ll either be voting for McCain or staying home if Hillary is the nominee. Why? As I said before, I know what I&#39;m getting and 5 out of the 8 things listed by Galaxy Girl I like about him. Among some other things. One could say its a personality versus policy issues with me, but whatever. Unless someone can give me a 100% guarantee , not 90% or 99% that Hillary is going to follow through with everything she is saying, nope. People call McCain a blood thirsty war monger, really? Hmm... you can say the exact same about Hillary. The only difference is he isn&#39;t going back on how he truly feels about it. There is a lot I don&#39;t like about Hillary&#39;s character and past political history enough for me to say no.

AfroPuff
03-07-2008, 05:17 AM
I am definitely NOT in favor of them being on the same ticket. Mrs. Clinton has gotten far too nasty for them to be on the same ticket. She has just really gone too far with her remarks and accusations. If she mentions that Obama only has "A speech" one more time, I just might explode. She had the nerve to say that she and McCain bring experience and Obama brings "a speech". Has she lost her mind? She is basically saying John McCain is even better than Obama. I am sooo entirely through with her.

I am really concerned that this nomination contest between Obama and Hillary is going to split the party. No matter who wins, there will be a huge group of unhappy people. We need to find a way to unify, but I don&#39;t know how.

napturallyme
03-07-2008, 05:24 AM
There is no way in hell I could ever cast my vote for McCain. The only thing on that list I can agree with is leaving the same-sex marriage issue up to the individual states.


Hillary right now is very iffy on if I can bring myself to vote for her. I actually am quite fine with her policy wise, except her healthcare plan, but I&#39;m not for Obama&#39;s either. My issue is that Hillary will probably not be able to push through the Democrat&#39;s policy because she&#39;s not a person who can draw in the other party. I think Obama will be better in crossing party lines to get things done. So, I really feel much won&#39;t be accomplished under Hillary&#39;s potential administration. But, I know this country will continue to go to hell in a bucket if McCain wins the general election. My other issue with Hillary is her dishonesty and ethics, the Clinton&#39;s are very shady with their business affairs. I know more scandals will be revealed.

kurliehead
03-07-2008, 05:34 AM
I can’t remember where I saw this, but somewhere they said that Obama and Hill would more than likely need a white man on their ticket to win in November, some one like John Edwards. In a way I can see that as a necessity to appeal to that demographic because after all this is still Amerikkka and racism and prejudice are still alive and kicking. Because although no one likes to admit it, there are a number of whites that wouldn’t vote for Obama because he’s Black or men who wouldn’t vote for Hillary because she’s a woman.

I don’t think HillBilly as the VP would work for Obama because those Republicans that say they would vote for him over McCain would probably rather eat glass than see IT back in Washington. Also, he would have to constantly watch his back with HillBilly around and would have to waste too much time cleaning up their mess.

GalaxyGirl2012
03-07-2008, 06:04 AM
So what makes everyone (in general) think that Hillary is better than McCain? As for me, I&#39;ve said I&#39;ll either be voting for McCain or staying home if Hillary is the nominee. Why? As I said before, I know what I&#39;m getting and 5 out of the 8 things listed by Galaxy Girl I like about him. Among some other things. One could say its a personality versus policy issues with me, but whatever. Unless someone can give me a 100% guarantee , not 90% or 99% that Hillary is going to follow through with everything she is saying, nope. People call McCain a blood thirsty war monger, really? Hmm... you can say the exact same about Hillary. The only difference is he isn&#39;t going back on how he truly feels about it. There is a lot I don&#39;t like about Hillary&#39;s character and past political history enough for me to say no.
[/b]

the main thing about mccain that frightens me is his temper. the reason why he was captured in vietnam was because of his temper (wanting to drop just 1 more bomb to show those bastards :rolleyes: ) and he still hasn&#39;t learned from that. the beach boy jokes about iran, the glee about wishing another world leader dead...

this man has hateful evil in his heart and i don&#39;t want him anywhere near control of our military or nuclear weapons. he&#39;s a 1-termer but somebody with that kind of "i&#39;m pissed at you so i&#39;ll just bomb you to hell and i don&#39;t care if you retaliate because i&#39;ll be safe in my bunker so I&#39;ll just bomb you again" mentality can do ALOT of damage to our country and the world in 4 years. think we&#39;re cash strapped now? wait til mccain decides it&#39;s time to invade iran, pakistan, cuba and china if they don&#39;t give up their communist ways. and i&#39;ll say it again: with less people signing on to the military where exactly do you think these bodies will come from to fight mccain&#39;s wars?

i can definitely live with hillary&#39;s opportunistic, let&#39;s make money hand over fist more so than mccain. his feelings about war in general is enough to make me never ever ever vote for that man.

and c&#39;mon gigglez there&#39;s no 100% guarantee with obama... i think most people are conveniently forgetting about how our government works. it isn&#39;t the president has an idea, waves a magic stick with an eagle on it and SHAZAM! BY THE POWER OF GREYSKULL! it&#39;s a law.

a presidential candidate can say until they are blue (or grey depending on their ethnicity) what they will do when they are elected. but the fact is all of that has to be run through senate and house. AND since our government can&#39;t walk and chew gum at the same time, cus they get sidetracked by stuff like subcommittees to the subcommittee of what to call french fries, it takes a ridiculously long time for legislation to get created let alone voted on let alone to be agreed upon.

just for you young &#39;uns out there who might never have seen this, here&#39;s a great introduction on how laws are made

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mEJL2Uuv-oQ

gigglezk
03-07-2008, 06:15 AM
I never said there was a 100% guarantee with Obama. You missed my point on the 100% guarantee. Hillary goes back on what she says all the time. Sure, politicians all do it. But not in the same damn breath. Some say Obama talks a good game. Well, Hillary sure as hell does too. His game is consistent, her game isn&#39;t. I can&#39;t even get her to stay 100% on just one issue. My whole point is she not less evil than McCain, she just does a better job at trying to hide it.

GalaxyGirl2012
03-07-2008, 06:23 AM
she&#39;s evil in a different way but i can live with her brand of evil. i think most people know what they will be getting with the clintons: bill pinching intern booty, hillary making side deals to make money and them stealing furniture out the white house when they leave. i won&#39;t even lie, if i were president i&#39;d also be tempted to keep a desk or a couch... ;)

but i&#39;m too pretty to live in the Mad Max post nuclear America that john mccain would create. if my choice is between a nagging shrillary with horn dog hubby or being traded as a sex slave for a pint of gas. i&#39;ll take choice a

gigglezk
03-07-2008, 06:25 AM
:lol: please tell me you are joking about them stealing furniture when they left. them some cheap azz mofos :lol:

GalaxyGirl2012
03-07-2008, 06:29 AM
:lol: please tell me you are joking about them stealing furniture when they left. them some cheap azz mofos :lol:
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:lol:
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0102/07/bn.03.html

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

STEPHEN FRAZIER, CNN ANCHOR: We&#39;re going to go back to Washington, now, where CNN&#39;s Bob Franken has learned that Bill and Hillary Clinton have told the White House they&#39;ll be sending back some of the furnishings which were presented to them as gifts on the occasion of their departing from the White House.

Here&#39;s Bob Franken from Capitol Hill -- Bob.

BOB FRANKEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Stephen, you know this is the $28,000 worth of furnishings, a couch, some kitchen set, et cetera, that there were questions raised whether it actually belonged to the White House or belonged to the Clintons.

The Clintons have decided, they said, to send the furniture back. Not that they are in any way acknowledging that the records didn&#39;t suggest that they had a right to those furnishings, but since questions are made, they wanted to make sure, they told the U.S. Park Service and the head usher of the White House, wanted to make sure that they did not inadvertently take something that did not belong to them.

Now, the Park Service has put out a statement saying that in fact it will receive the material. The Park Service is the legal custodian of donations that are made to the White House. The Park Service will keep it. A spokesman for the Park Service said that it was his understanding that the material was being shipped right now.

So, the Clintons have decided to end the controversy, even though they clearly argue that the records show they had a right to the furniture. They are sending back that $28,000.

Of course, the home furnishings that the Clintons took with them have been controversial since they left the White House. As a matter of fact, they agreed to pay for about half of it out of a foundation. So they&#39;re trying to end this controversy, and of course, Steve, hopefully end all the controversies around the home furnishings.

FRAZIER: Bob Franken with a breaking news story, right up to the final moments of our program. Bob, thank you very much.


____________

:lol: as to thegift aspect. i think this might have been a case of bill making it a gift to hillary :lol:

oh yeah there were some vandalism charges too
http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/t/tra...ewhitehouse.htm (http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/t/trashingthewhitehouse.htm)

The Clinton Staff-Truth!





bullet Summary of eRumor:
When George W. Bush took over the presidency in 2001, his new staff arrived in the offices of the White House to find that there had been widespread pranks and vandalism by the departing Clinton staff. Published reports said computers were left unusable, pornography was found on both computers and walls, and telephone systems were trashed by the cutting of cables and wires.
bullet

The Truth:
The final, official report from the Government Accounting Office was released on June 11, 2002. The 220 page document says there was damage, although not as much as some of the early reports had suggested. The GAO says the damage included 62 missing computer keyboards, 26 cell phones, two cameras, ten antique doorknobs and several presidential medallions and office signs. The damage estimate was about $20,000. Clinton critics say the report proves that the departing Clinton staff members acted recklessly and disrespectfully. Clinton supporters say the report shows that the allegations of vandalism were exaggerated and that there were similar incidents when Clinton took over the White House from the staff of George Bush.

The GAO report concludes that even though damage was verified and that some of it appeared to have been intentional, there was not clear evidence of who was responsible for it.

This has been a subject of contention since President Bush took office. There were reports of vandalism, graffiti, and obscene messages in White House offices by outgoing Clinton staffers. Bush downplayed the reports saying he wanted to move on with the presidency. Clinton supporters, however, charged that the story was not true and that the Bush forces had made up the story to make Bush&#39;s staff look better than Clinton&#39;s. Former President Clinton offered to pay for any damage and his supporters called for an investigation.

May 18, 2001 the General Accounting Office issued a three-page letter that said that it was unable confirm the damage largely to a lack of records from the White House. The letter also said that the condition of the White House offices was "...consistent with what we would expect to encounter when tenants vacate office space after an extended occupancy." As to any details of damage, the GAO letter said For supporters of former President Clinton, that seemed to end the matter. They proclaimed victory, called the whole story an urban legend, and asked the White House to apologize.

In response, White House press secretary Ari Fleischer outlined the details of the damage, most of which was in the Eisenhower Execitive Office Building adjacent to the White House. On June 3, 2001 The Washington Post quoted Fleischer as saying that the damage included the removal of the letter "W" from 100 computer keyboards, five missing brass nameplates with the presidential seal on them, 75 telephones with cover plates missing or apparently intentionally plugged into the wrong wall outlets, six fax machines relocated in the same way, ten cut phone lines, two historic door knobs missing, overturned desks and furniture in about 20 percent of the offices, obscene graffiti in six offices, and eight 14-foot loads of usable office supplies recovered from the trash. According to Fleischer, there was one incident in the White House itself, a photocopy machine that had copies of naked people hidden in the paper tray so they would come out from time to time with other copies.

Critics of the Bush administration said they didn&#39;t trust the White House report.

On June 5, 2001, the General Accounting Office announced that it had launched an investigation into the matter, which was released on June 11, 2002.

There was a companion story that Air Force One had been the victim of the outgoing Clintons and that numerous items from aboard the plane had been pilfered. President Bush himself told reporters aboard Air Force one on February 12, 2001, that the report was not true. According to Salon Washington correspondent Jake Tipper, Bush brought up the subject because the chief steward aboard Air Force One told him the allegations were false.

gigglezk
03-07-2008, 06:43 AM
:lol: :lol: :lol:

ThummyB
03-07-2008, 06:47 AM
Let me first say I&#39;m not trying to disrespect you at all. Not at all.

But honestly you never did answer the question.

The question was for you to expand on your choice for endorsing McCain over Hillary. While you spoke on why you disliked and distrusted Hillary you never spoke on McCain. Yes, you mentioned you had a little respect for him; but you didn&#39;t tell us anything about him that made you like him over her.
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Just chiming in...

I truly dislike it when ppl inquire about your personal choices/tastes and then act as if you OWE them a response. Voting is a very personal activity. No one is required to justify or explain their reasoning, and you have no right to assume that you know what qualities any other person values.


Regarding the Clinton/Obama or Obama/Clinton ticket: I think that it could happen. Honestly, I don&#39;t think that the campaigning or tactics in this election is any worse than what occurs in the standard elections. In part the media hypes up every negative comment or criticism, and folks tend to run with that as if the candidates should spend all of their time saying nice things about one another. Sure dirty tactics aren&#39;t fun, but they aren&#39;t unheard of and haven&#39;t stopped prior candidates from joining forces. However, I don&#39;t think that the two of them together would be a winning ticket. I agree that a white male is needed in the VP spot to appease more conservative dems and liberal reps.

GalaxyGirl2012
03-07-2008, 06:52 AM
ok even though this is old news but i&#39;m extremely bored. I&#39;ll be working from home for the next 2-6 months because our office has structural damage. it&#39;s incredibly depressing sine i have to spend 40 hours a week cooped up in my bedroom where my desk is, so i&#39;ll be posting alot :lol:

anyway, here&#39;s a better article from bbc (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/low/americas/1160437.stm) with a list of the gifts :

Former US President Bill Clinton and Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton have returned $28,000 worth of White House furnishings they took with them when he left office.

A spokesman for the Clintons, Jake Siewert, said that "at this point, everything&#39;s been returned to the Park Service, and we&#39;ll leave it to them to decide what to do about it".

The couple have come under a flood of criticism from politicians and the media over expensive gifts they received in their final year in the White House.

The Clintons have argued that none of the gifts they took, including some $23,000 worth of household furnishings, was on a curator&#39;s list of official White House property.

Pay-back time

Last week they announced they would pay back $86,000 - slightly less than half the value of the $190,000 in gifts they are reported to have received.

Gift list
Denise Rich: Coffee tables and chairs, $7,300
Ronald and Beth Dozoretz: Dining table, server and golf clubs, $7,000
Steven Spielberg: China, $4,920
Ted Danson and Mary Steenburger: China, $4,800
Jack Nicholson: Golf club, $350
Sylvester Stallone: Boxing gloves, $300
The National Park Service, which acts as a steward for the White House, said it would keep the furniture until the ownership question was resolved.

The White House curator&#39;s office is working with the Clintons to clear up any confusion about whether the items the couple took were personal gifts or items that were supposed to stay, White House press secretary Ari Fleischer said.

Two furniture makers whose donations the Clintons took with them have said their gifts were part of the $396,000 refurbishment of the executive mansion, and were not meant for the Clintons personally, the Washington Post reported.

But Bill Clinton&#39;s office issued a statement saying the furniture was removed from the executive mansion with the approval of the White House Usher&#39;s and Curator&#39;s Offices.

Clinton friends

The controversial gifts include two coffee tables and chairs worth $7,375 from Denise Rich, a top Democratic Party fundraiser.

Clintons&#39; new home

Mrs Rich spent last year lobbying for a presidential pardon for her former husband, who fled the country in 1983 under indictment for tax evasion and racketeering. Marc Rich received a pardon from the former president as he left office.

The gifts being repaid include furniture, televisions, clothing, china and works of art.

Also among the people to be repaid are movie mogul Steven Spielberg and actors Kate Capshaw, Ted Danson and Mary Steenburger.

Actor Jack Nicholson is also expected to receive payment for a golf driver worth $350.

gigglezk
03-07-2008, 07:00 AM
STOP IT GALAXY!!!!! You are giving me heart burn with all this laughing. DH just told me there were reports of them stealing all of the "W" keys off of the keyboards too. :lol:

sidenote, I work from home too. The best advice I can give is stay away from pogo.com.

Lady-N-Black
03-07-2008, 07:27 AM
Just chiming in...
I truly dislike it when ppl inquire about your personal choices/tastes and then act as if you OWE them a response.
[/b]

We&#39;re having a discussion/debate. That is what happens when you offer up your opinion in an open discussion/debate on anything......it is challenged.

If this politics forum were just a "post what you think" forum where it wasn&#39;t open for discussion I could see your point- but since Its an open forum to discuss politics.......well <_< no.

No, I can&#39;t assume anything about what she finds as quality in another person....thats why I asked. And honestly I don&#39;t see anything wrong with my asking because if were just here to throw out a statement and expect no feedback where is the stimulation? where is the sharing of ideas? how can we learn from each other? My question wasn&#39;t disrespectful or intrusive. period.



So what makes everyone (in general) think that Hillary is better than McCain?
[/b]

Hey sis, to answer your question,
-I am pro-choice
-Anti - War
-Gay
-Anti- Death Penalty

and honestly though I don&#39;t trust Hillary look at it this way. With McCain we WILL remain in war, gays WILL remain oppressed (as will women and minorites in general) and there WILL be no effort to lift the death penalty. With Hillary all of these are maybes (perhaps even probablys) but at least I have a fighting chance. I&#39;d rather go with the underhanded maybe than the absolute &#39;its gonna happen&#39; I feel she is the lesser of two evils. and I really believe that the democrats won&#39;t let her push her personal agenda but SO far before they pull her reins.

gigglezk
03-07-2008, 08:57 AM
Eh...IMO, I don&#39;t see the war, gay oppression, or the death penalty going away anytime soon no matter who is president.

Lady-N-Black
03-07-2008, 09:00 AM
Eh...IMO, I don&#39;t see the war, gay oppression, or the death penalty going away anytime soon no matter who is president.
[/b]

That I know for SURE but I think one candidate more than the other will get us closer to making those changes.

Karibana
03-07-2008, 09:12 AM
I&#39;m not an American so obviously I can&#39;t vote and my opinion matters little in this race but I will say this: I vote for a party more then I vote for a leader. I have cancelled my ballots for years because I didn&#39;t like what my party of choice had to offer and I didn&#39;t find the alternative any more palatable (sp?). So if I was American, I would vote for Hillary should she get the nomination simply because the alternative is McCain in the White House, not because of his position on Irak but because of what the GOP stands for alot of things that I disagree with.

Alastri
03-07-2008, 11:52 AM
Thanks GG ^_^ I guess I can still hate McCain then, I have no reason to like him. The only thing I&#39;m unsure about is the death penalty.

gigglezk
03-07-2008, 12:58 PM
Ha! Just as I suspected. Hillary is hinting at a joint ticket as a way to get people to vote for her. This is her way of trying to find a solution so that the party isn&#39;t split. I don&#39;t think so slick hilly.

Alastri
03-07-2008, 02:13 PM
^^well, at least the party wouldn&#39;t be split, right? :dunno:

gigglezk
03-07-2008, 02:18 PM
^^^It&#39;s pretty much too late for that. And, Hillary doesn&#39;t give a rat&#39;s azz about the party. Her "solution" is just a ploy.

Lady-N-Black
03-07-2008, 02:50 PM
.... or write in my dog&#39;s name.
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Lol...... :P sweet Jesus, Rukiya, you&#39;re gonna kill me.

China
03-07-2008, 04:49 PM
My hope is for Obama to take the nomination so not only no...hell no!

Don&#39;t wanna smell Hilary&#39;s stank polluting Obama&#39;s presidential bid as his VP, and hopefully he&#39;d never even consider running as her VP since Obama is far too classy and intelligent to be driving Miss Daisey.

In this situation - the king should not take or settle for 2nd when he came for 1st!

For the longest time I felt I&#39;d vote for Hilary if I had to, but that is soooo done and ain&#39;t a damn thang that ***** can do, at this point, to get my vote.

If she somehow manages to win the party nomination I&#39;mma sit back, laugh and enjoy watching Republicans tear Hilary&#39;s azz up. Then, in November, I&#39;ll vote for Ralph Nader or write in my dog&#39;s name.
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Hmm...if all else fails, I might need your dog&#39;s full name in November. :P

I was feeling McCain over Clinton for awhile, but he&#39;s alienated me too as he stumps for the conservative vote. Not voting for either. As polarizing as Hillary is, I dont foresee any real change in she takes office. Her only hope is Democrats maintaining control of the House and Senate, and her presence might galvanize the Republican Party to seize control in 4 years. I think McCain is hot headed too (like Clinton), but I don&#39;t see any authorizations for new wars passing in the Senate if he&#39;s president. I think the many Clinton scandals have rendered her ineffective of any real changes at this point.

GalaxyGirl2012
03-07-2008, 05:09 PM
Hmm...if all else fails, I might need your dog&#39;s full name in November. :P

I was feeling McCain over Clinton for awhile, but he&#39;s alienated me too as he stumps for the conservative vote. Not voting for either. As polarizing as Hillary is, I dont foresee any real change in she takes office. Her only hope is Democrats maintaining control of the House and Senate, and her presence might galvanize the Republican Party to seize control in 4 years. I think McCain is hot headed too (like Clinton), but I don&#39;t see any authorizations for new wars passing in the Senate if he&#39;s president. I think the many Clinton scandals have rendered her ineffective of any real changes at this point.
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but president&#39;s dont need to make an official war in order to go off and kill people they dont agree with. as commander in chief a president can make the decision to send troops without getting any authorization from congress. it&#39;s happened over 100 times in US history. these are called police actions and although it&#39;s protocol for presidents to wait for authority from congres, they don&#39;t have to.

also under the iraq resolution (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authorization_for_Use_of_Military_Force_Against_Ir aq_Resolution_of_2002) there&#39;s is a certain amount of slack given to the president on how s/he will deem what&#39;s needed.
the clause : "as he determines to be necessary and appropriate" in order to "defend the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed by Iraq; and enforce all relevant United Nations Security Council Resolutions regarding Iraq."

could VERY easily be turned into the excuse of al quaeda terrorists are leaking in to iraq by way of iran and syria. under the iraq resolution the Prez would be free to extend the war in iraq into other countries. If I figured this out, you best believe Mad Dog McCain has as well.

China
03-08-2008, 01:12 PM
^^^I think Clinton is as capable of doing the same. Her husbands administration has its dirt too. http://www.fff.org/freedom/0101e.asp

Sacral
03-08-2008, 02:13 PM
^^^I think Clinton is as capable of doing the same. Her husbands administration has its dirt too. http://www.fff.org/freedom/0101e.asp
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I sooooooo resent this article :Angry: . First of all, this is nothing like the American invasion of Iraq. I won&#39;t even go into details about that. Too obvious.

Second, to understand the history of Eastern Europe today one has to look at the history of the Former Soviet Union. White people don&#39;t want to admit this, but "tribalism" in Eastern Eurupe after the fall of the Soviet Union is no different than the civil wars (again, "tribalism") all over the African continent after colonialism "officially" ended.

My own example: I don&#39;t think Nigeria should be a country. The Biafran War is a clear example of that.

When borders for countries are drawn by invaders and maintained by force after said invaders "leave", civil war/tribalism is what happens. Bill Clinton made a decision and did something. Yet, he&#39;s bashed for not doing anything about Rwanda and defering to the UN instead. Whatever.

Kosovo and Rwanda.......Pretty much the same scenario and history (just replace Russians with Belgiums).

Back to the OP..........When it comes to the Hillary being president, the office will most definitely be a co-presidency. Hillary will be running ish by her husband every chance she gets, especially about the economy (&#39;cause Bill can most definitely turn this economy around. He did it last time after Reagan and Bush made such a sewage dump out of it). And if they don&#39;t agree she&#39;s just going to do what she wants as President. Y&#39;all married NP&#39;ers know what I&#39;m talking about............There&#39;s really no need for a VP in that situation. Edwards would be happy to take it.

But if Obama takes the VP slot his talent will be wasted, Michelle would try to cut Hillary with the knife in her bra for disrespecting her husband, Bill will end up siding with Obama after so many fights with Hillary, and Hillary will end up being a.......One termer.

ThummyB
03-08-2008, 07:23 PM
We&#39;re having a discussion/debate. That is what happens when you offer up your opinion in an open discussion/debate on anything......it is challenged.

If this politics forum were just a "post what you think" forum where it wasn&#39;t open for discussion I could see your point- but since Its an open forum to discuss politics.......well <_< no.

[/b]

You can disagree on or desire to discuss anything that you&#39;d like, but that has no bearing on the other party owing you a response or explanation of any sort.

In general you can vote any way that you&#39;d like and volunteer your reasoning behind that decision in a desire to persuade someone else, but no one is obligated to justify their voting decision to you.



No, I can&#39;t assume anything about what she finds as quality in another person....thats why I asked. And honestly I don&#39;t see anything wrong with my asking because if were just here to throw out a statement and expect no feedback where is the stimulation? where is the sharing of ideas? how can we learn from each other? My question wasn&#39;t disrespectful or intrusive. period.
[/b]

Now I absolutely agree that discussion and exchange are insightful and beneficial. However, don&#39;t get mad, which you seemed to be, if the other person simply doesn&#39;t care to further participate...that&#39;s their right.

GalaxyGirl2012
03-08-2008, 07:50 PM
if the article that article is inferring that because of clinton, america&#39;s actions in kosovo put us in the same category as russia&#39;s handling in chechnaya, then i i believe the author isn&#39;t looking at the full picture. it was pretty clear why we were there: to help kosovo be it&#39;s own country. if there really was a 1:1 correlation between the two then russia wouldnt have a problem with recognizing kosovo as a sovereign state.

also, i dont see how this is related to the iraq war resolution... there was no legislation created that gives the president unlimited powers of redefining what&#39;s a threat and wasn&#39;t.

also clinton has not stated in debates or speeches that she&#39;s already decide on going to war with other countries. mccain has:
iran (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hAzBxFaio1I)

now that i think about it, i can leave syria out of my list of places mccain would wage war. we can just help israel do it and that way it doesn&#39;t have to seem to be from america

palmerz63
03-08-2008, 08:19 PM
:offtop: I didn&#39;t want to start another topic. But wasn&#39;t Hillary against the war a few months ago.

Peaches
03-08-2008, 10:55 PM
Bill Clinton:
"I know that she has always been open to it, because she believes that if you can unite the energy and the new people that he&#39;s brought in and the people in these vast swaths of small town and rural America that she&#39;s carried overwhelmingly, if you had those two things together she thinks it&#39;d be hard to beat."

He added that, in his view, Obama would win the "urban areas and the upscale voters" while Clinton claims "the traditional rural areas that we lost when President Reagan was president. If you put those two things together, you&#39;d have an almost unstoppable force."

Obama:
"You won&#39;t see me as a vice presidential candidate, you know, I&#39;m running for president"

link (http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/)

Obama is nobody&#39;s flunky, nobody&#39;s pawn, nobody&#39;s &#39;yes man&#39;, and nobody&#39;s fool.

napturallyme
03-09-2008, 06:41 AM
Obama:
"You won&#39;t see me as a vice presidential candidate, you know, I&#39;m running for president"

link (http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/)

Obama is nobody&#39;s flunky, nobody&#39;s pawn, nobody&#39;s &#39;yes man&#39;, and nobody&#39;s fool.
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I know that&#39;s right Barack! :lol:

GalaxyGirl2012
03-09-2008, 08:22 AM
i had an interesting conversation yesterday with 2 of my coworkers from iowa about this.

mind you these 2 guys are ultra conservative (one&#39;s mormon and was a romney supporter)
the other was a ron paul supporter.
anyway both were in agreement that among their conservative buds (many of which are anti-war) if the choice is between mccain and obama then they will vote obama. if the choice is between mccain and clinton they will choose mccain.

i asked about the joint ticket and they were both like if obama gets the nomination he just needs to run away from hillary like he doesn&#39;t know her. they said they still wouldnt vote for her even if he were on the VP role. i think everybody knows that whoever accepts that VP role if clinton gets the nominee is resigning themselves to 4 years of virtually being locked in locker in the white house gym with the jock straps.


:offtop:

also one of the guys brought up a point that he knows many veterans who are anti-clinton because they ignored bin laden when he attacked all those embassies and uss cole. clinton had opportunities to catch him but didn&#39;t pursue it because monica gate was going on and he didnt want people to think he was doing it to divert attention.

China
03-09-2008, 08:42 AM
I most definitely wasnt making a comparison to the war in Iraq, it was in reference to McCain possibly invading other areas and dropping bombs.

I generally disagree with Republicans AND Democrats on foreign policy. ALOT. I&#39;ll just leave it at that.



i had an interesting conversation yesterday with 2 of my coworkers from iowa about this.

mind you these 2 guys are ultra conservative (one&#39;s mormon and was a romney supporter)
the other was a ron paul supporter.
anyway both were in agreement that among their conservative buds (many of which are anti-war) if the choice is between mccain and obama then they will vote obama. if the choice is between mccain and clinton they will choose mccain.

i asked about the joint ticket and they were both like if obama gets the nomination he just needs to run away from hillary like he doesn&#39;t know her. they said they still wouldnt vote for her even if he were on the VP role. i think everybody knows that whoever accepts that VP role if clinton gets the nominee is resigning themselves to 4 years of virtually being locked in locker in the white house gym with the jock straps.
:offtop:

also one of the guys brought up a point that he knows many veterans who are anti-clinton because they ignored bin laden when he attacked all those embassies and uss cole. clinton had opportunities to catch him but didn&#39;t pursue it because monica gate was going on and he didnt want people to think he was doing it to divert attention.
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I don&#39;t think either should be the other&#39;s VP, both for Obama&#39;s sake.lol This is going to sound extreme, but if she were his VP, that&#39;s the only time I would really worry about his safety. Yall can figure out why. :lol:

GalaxyGirl2012
03-09-2008, 08:49 AM
^^^^

oh yeah i don&#39;t think she&#39;d above a little poison over the presidential sweet tea from a secret compartment of her wedding ring a la lucretia borgia.

looking back at whitewater and ron brown... it&#39;s very possible.

TwistedXn
03-09-2008, 10:01 AM
It seems that if HRC is nominated, she would NEED Obama as her running mate in order to galvanize the influence he has with others and to unite the party. But I think that if he accepted the VP nomination, it would be political suicide for any later pursuits he may want to be involved in. HRC is known to be a belt-way divider and not much would be accomplished during her term, especially if the Dems had neither Senate nor House control. (Even if Dems did control one or the other, there still may be a p/contest between the female prez and good-old-boy legislative branch, but who knows :dunno: ).

HRC&#39;s team may also be looking into whether BillC could assume the seat as VP. The only stickler regarding this possibility is whether he could assume the presidential slot if anything happened to her. There is no clear legal answer to the question, but it&#39;s certainly being kicked around.

On the other hand, BHO has little need for HRC for a successful nomination or presidential administration. It was my thought that he would seriously consider John Edwards for VP, until Dee wrote this:


I&#39;d prefer an Obama / Bloomberg ticket.[/b]
Dang . . . that would be a helluva ticket. I&#39;d work the campaign trail in my Obama Air Force Ones (http://www.bossip.com/12019/obama-air-force-ones/) for that one.

Lady-N-Black
03-09-2008, 10:02 AM
You can disagree on or desire to discuss anything that you&#39;d like, but that has no bearing on the other party owing you a response or explanation of any sort.

In general you can vote any way that you&#39;d like and volunteer your reasoning behind that decision in a desire to persuade someone else, but no one is obligated to justify their voting decision to you.
Now I absolutely agree that discussion and exchange are insightful and beneficial. However, don&#39;t get mad, which you seemed to be, if the other person simply doesn&#39;t care to further participate...that&#39;s their right.
[/b]

I understand where you&#39;re coming from, I really do. But understand, anytime you offer up an opinion anywhere referring to someone as bad or one person as better than another you should be able- and more importantly willing to back up that statement with reasons; or at least try.

Throwing out a statement and then hiding under the cover of "Well, I don&#39;t want to discuss that because voting is personal" is bogus. If it is so personal then you shouldn&#39;t be offering up pieces of opinion in an open forum. Besides, I wasn&#39;t getting angry, I was asking for an explaination that I hoped was there.

napturallyme
03-09-2008, 10:14 AM
HRC&#39;s team may also be looking into whether BillC could assume the seat as VP. The only stickler regarding this possibility is whether he could assume the presidential slot if anything happened to her. There is no clear legal answer to the question, but it&#39;s certainly being kicked around.

[/b]

If I&#39;m not mistaken the Constitution says a person can&#39;t be elected to serve more then 2 4-year terms. So I think Bill might be able to VP because if something happened to Hill, he will be Pres based on being second in line, not by an election. If he can&#39;t serve as Pres, then the Speaker of the House would probably be selected.

Lady-N-Black
03-09-2008, 12:37 PM
If I&#39;m not mistaken the Constitution says a person can&#39;t be elected to serve more then 2 4-year terms.
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I thought that only applied consecutively (sp) for instance you could run for 2- 4 year terms, then after someone else has held the office you could run again? I dunno.



I generally disagree with Republicans AND Democrats on foreign policy. ALOT. I&#39;ll just leave it at that.
I don&#39;t think either should be the other&#39;s VP, both for Obama&#39;s sake.lol This is going to sound extreme, but if she were his VP, that&#39;s the only time I would really worry about his safety. Yall can figure out why. :lol:
[/b]

This is sooooo true. Back to an earlier discussion though about writing in...I never thought about writing in Obamas name if he didn&#39;t get it. I&#39;m pretty sure that will be my choice.

PrincessDrRe
03-09-2008, 12:47 PM
My take on the McCain before Clinton vote is this....

It&#39;s the lesser of two EVIL AZZ EVILS....JMO

GalaxyGirl2012
03-09-2008, 01:37 PM
That would be great. I got the impression today - I don&#39;t really know why - that Bloomberg would team up with Obama if he gets the nom and McCain if Hillary gets the nom. :D
[/b]

me too!

i think bloomberg wanted to enter the race because he thought there might be an opening for an independant. once he saw who the leaders were on each side he dropped out because obama and mccain can both pull independents.

obama/bloomberg would be great! the only other person who mccain could get who would be that knowledgeable about the economy would be ron paul, and there&#39;s noway ron paul would do a VP with mccain

psalm34
03-09-2008, 01:41 PM
Interesting comment today from Meet the Press: (My husband is a news addict. The pundits are always on in my house!)

FMR. SEN. DASCHLE: Well, Tim, it&#39;s really a rare occurrence, maybe the first time in history, that the person who&#39;s running number two would offer the person who&#39;s running number one the number two position. What Barack has said is that&#39;s way premature. He doesn&#39;t have any interest in being vice president. He&#39;s going to be our presidential nominee.
Someone else commented this morning that Obama could win the general election without Hillary but Hillary could not win without Obama.

It&#39;s amazing how the stories are spinning as if Hillary gained some substantial ground this week.
The Washington Post had a really good political online cartoon this week. It showed all the press basically worshipping Obama like he was some sort of god. Then you see a little mud slung at him. Then the same worshippers turn into attackers. Funny but so true! http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/opini...es03052008.html (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/opinions/cartoonsandvideos/telnaes/telnaes03052008.html)

seek_first
03-09-2008, 05:22 PM
It just irks me how Hillary has been trailing Obama for the past month, but yet has the nerve to talk about "considering" to put Obama as the vp on her ticket.

Karibana
03-09-2008, 05:31 PM
It just irks me how Hillary has been trailing Obama for the past month, but yet has the nerve to talk about "considering" to put Obama as the vp on her ticket.
[/b]

It&#39;s all about image, she can&#39;t look defeated and she has to maintain the idea that she&#39;s actually is the one calling the shots. If you repeat something often enough some might actually believe it.

PrincessDrRe
03-09-2008, 05:47 PM
I am a millionaire.
I am a millionaire.
I am a millionaire.
I am a millionaire.
I am a millionaire.
I am a millionaire.

Nope....still ain&#39;t true.....

BrownsuggaDIVA
03-09-2008, 05:55 PM
I am a millionaire.
I am a millionaire.
I am a millionaire.
I am a millionaire.
I am a millionaire.
I am a millionaire.

Nope....still ain&#39;t true.....
[/b]
<_< beat me to it.


:lol:


no but seriously..u DID! :Angry:

^_^

seek_first
03-09-2008, 05:57 PM
It&#39;s all about image, she can&#39;t look defeated and she has to maintain the idea that she&#39;s actually is the one calling the shots. If you repeat something often enough some might actually believe it.
[/b]


I guess Hillary watched The Secret.

PrincesDrRe... you are hilarious!

Karibana
03-09-2008, 06:30 PM
I&#39;m 15 pounds lighter :unsure:

snicy
03-09-2008, 06:50 PM
The more I hear her talk about this, the more I think it is a very shrewd strategy on her part.

I get the feeling she is hinting to people that if they vote for her and she gets the nomination, she will offer Prez Obama the VP position. She knows good and well that he would never take the offer which lets her off the hook, because afterall, she DID ask. And now it&#39;s too late because she has the nomination. <_<

The only campaign talking about this is the Clinton campaign, Prez Obama made it clear that he is running for the position of the PRESIDENT OF THE US. &#39;nuff said. :P

ChandraNH
03-09-2008, 06:51 PM
Off topic: Karibana, you are just too beautiful, everytime I see your avatar, I&#39;m just stunned. Where&#39;d you get those glasses?

Peaches
03-09-2008, 07:19 PM
I think it is a very shrewd strategy on her part.

I get the feeling she is hinting to people that if they vote for her and she gets the nomination, she will offer Prez Obama the VP position. She knows good and well that he would never take the offer which lets her off the hook, because afterall, she DID ask. And now it&#39;s too late because she has the nomination. <_<
[/b]
The only problem with this theory is that

1) She isn&#39;t smart enough to think of it

2) Obama&#39;s supporters will not vote for her to see him as VP, they want HIM as president

3) She is delusional and really thinks that she can beat him

and

4) She is trying to rub in his face that she won in Ohio and is touting the victory by &#39;offering him a job&#39;.

If Bill Clinton thinks that Obama is going to actually help Hillbilly win the presidency after she has hollered "Shame on you" to the world, he has been smoking way too much reefer. Why would anyone yell "Shame on you" in front of the whole world and turn around and offer them a job?

Karibana
03-10-2008, 06:09 AM
Off topic: Karibana, you are just too beautiful, everytime I see your avatar, I&#39;m just stunned. Where&#39;d you get those glasses?
[/b]

Girl you&#39;re making me :blush: I got them at Greiche and Scaff, an optometry chain here. The brand is Soho, I think the model is 6108 in burgundy.

southernbelllle
03-10-2008, 10:29 AM
i swear sometimes i think yall got issues
:lol: :lol: :lol:

Karibana
03-10-2008, 12:05 PM
...and thatz real. Skin like silk!

Yo, Karibana, you married? You like Ricans? Cuz I got a cousin that&#39;s finally ready to settle down. He kinda Ricky Martin-ish but he is a good guy, educated, got a job and would tear yo azz up...
[/b]

:lol: :lol: :lol: I&#39;ll let this thread get back on topic now.

nvsnot
03-10-2008, 12:08 PM
Barack fired up a crowd of over 1,700 in Columbus, Mississippi today...

Barack specifically responded to Clinton&#39;s suggestion that he might make a good vice president.

"I don&#39;t understand. If I&#39;m not ready, how is it do you think I would be such a great vice president? Do you understand that?" he said, as the crowd erupted in applause.

"I am not running for vice president," he said. "I am running for President of the United States of America. I am running to be Commander in Chief."

CoCo2000
03-10-2008, 12:47 PM
Interesting comment today from Meet the Press

FMR. SEN. DASCHLE: Well, Tim, it&#39;s really a rare occurrence, maybe the first time in history, that the person who&#39;s running number two would offer the person who&#39;s running number one the number two position. What Barack has said is that&#39;s way premature. He doesn&#39;t have any interest in being vice president. He&#39;s going to be our presidential nominee.
Someone else commented this morning that Obama could win the general election without Hillary but Hillary could not win without Obama.[/b]
The roundtable discussion on this show almost had me second guessing my thinking that a joint-ticket would not work because there were some pretty compelling arguments and the whole show was just very interesting. I think this is the first time a news hour went by so quickly to me! :huh:

Anyhoo, here is a link to the entire show, including Sen. Daschle&#39;s face-off with the govenor of Penn. and the roundtable discussion. It also includes a video comment by former Sen. Bill Bradley that I think the Obama campaign should use if they decide to do more negative campaigning. I hate the thought of that, but, it is what it is.......

Video of Interesting arguments on Meet the Press (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/23547550#23547550)

napturallyme
03-10-2008, 12:58 PM
I&#39;m glad Barack spoke up today about being on the same ticket. Now maybe Clinton will shut up about it.

curlycoilyfroily
03-10-2008, 01:04 PM
^^^Barack played the sh!t out of Hillary in Columbus. I can&#39;t wait to see what her response is going to be.

NappyMiami
03-10-2008, 01:05 PM
See I think HillBilly shows many of the signs of an abused woman. All that serial cheating has taken a toll on her. She doesn&#39;t understand that you don&#39;t burn a bridge and then try to walk on it. That&#39;s because she has had more than 30 years of a dysfunctional relationship where unspeakable things have been done and they stayed together. So she thinks she can throw all this crap at Obama and they will kiss and make up because that is what she is used to. I think she needs meds. Seriously. All jokes aside.
[/b]

DANG!

That was deep............

Can of makes you wonder.............I think your right about that one!

missladee622
03-10-2008, 01:07 PM
I&#39;m not going for that.
Especially how she&#39;s talking about Obama as VP.
Whatever!!

Sacral
03-10-2008, 02:27 PM
Interesting comment today from Meet the Press: (My husband is a news addict. The pundits are always on in my house!)

FMR. SEN. DASCHLE: Well, Tim, it&#39;s really a rare occurrence, maybe the first time in history, that the person who&#39;s running number two would offer the person who&#39;s running number one the number two position. What Barack has said is that&#39;s way premature. He doesn&#39;t have any interest in being vice president. He&#39;s going to be our presidential nominee.
Someone else commented this morning that Obama could win the general election without Hillary but Hillary could not win without Obama.

It&#39;s amazing how the stories are spinning as if Hillary gained some substantial ground this week.
The Washington Post had a really good political online cartoon this week. It showed all the press basically worshipping Obama like he was some sort of god. Then you see a little mud slung at him. Then the same worshippers turn into attackers. Funny but so true! http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/opini...es03052008.html (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/opinions/cartoonsandvideos/telnaes/telnaes03052008.html)
[/b]

Meet The Press is one of the higher-level political pundit shows. I never miss it on Sunday.

GalaxyGirl2012
03-10-2008, 02:59 PM
Video of Interesting arguments on Meet the Press (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/23547550#23547550)
[/b]

minor off topic rant: i&#39;m i the only one who always has issue with their stupid player? there is no rhyme or reason to how you geta video to play. clicking the video doesn&#39;t work. adding it to your playlist and then clicking it doesn&#39;t work. i end up spending 15 minutes to get a video to play and then it just happens.

what am i doing wrong?

China
03-10-2008, 04:51 PM
Meet The Press is one of the higher-level political pundit shows. I never miss it on Sunday.
[/b]

Me neither. I don&#39;t get out of bed on Sundays until after the show goes off. Sometimes, I stay in bed an hour longer to watch McLaughlin&#39;s crazy shows.

Also, one thing that also stands out to me is that Tim Russert seems to have a passion for what he&#39;s doing and does a better job than most at being objective (not that he&#39;s perfect).

britni
03-10-2008, 05:29 PM
^^^I think I&#39;d say the same about Chris Matthews too. ^_^

Sacral
03-10-2008, 05:38 PM
Me neither. I don&#39;t get out of bed on Sundays until after the show goes off. Sometimes, I stay in bed an hour longer to watch McLaughlin&#39;s crazy shows.

[/b]

^^^McLaughlin is another pretty good show, though I don&#39;t know if your average American can follow their arguments and debates since all of the commetators are "inside-the-beltway". They are all really close to the process and rub elbows with elected officials and presidential appointees on Capital Hill all of the time. They get to the bare bones of many issues in a short period of time. That show is sometimes just :lol: . Debates, pot-shots and comebacks, and all..........



Also, one thing that also stands out to me is that Tim Russert seems to have a passion for what he&#39;s doing and does a better job than most at being objective (not that he&#39;s perfect).[/b]

ITA. Tim Russert has pretty good political interviewing skills.




^^^I think I&#39;d say the same about Chris Matthews too. ^_^
[/b]


Chris Matthew is pretty good, as well.


I don&#39;t watch Hannity and Combs or O&#39;Reilly. I can&#39;t take them seriously and it&#39;s a waste of time.

taniseka
03-10-2008, 06:02 PM
Video of Interesting arguments on Meet the Press (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/23547550#23547550)
[/b]

that music made me feel like I was watching star wars or some epic movie :lol:

missladee622
03-11-2008, 05:36 AM
I&#39;ve always loved the Meet the Press music. :lol: :lol:

psalm34
03-11-2008, 07:01 AM
^^^I think I&#39;d say the same about Chris Matthews too. ^_^
[/b]

Co-signing on this. DH has my mom and me hooked on watching his show every evening. Watching it has kept me up to date with this whole process.

nvsnot
03-11-2008, 12:31 PM
Even the House Speaker knows a joint ticket is not going to happen (http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/)
March 11, 2008
Pelosi: Joint ticket &#39;impossible&#39;
Posted: 03:50 PM ET

Pelosi said Tuesday a so-called &#39;Dream Ticket&#39; won&#39;t happen.
(CNN) — A so-called "dream ticket" scenario - the idea that Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama could join forces this fall — may have gripped the imaginations of Democrats nationwide - but you can list House Speaker Nancy Pelosi as a skeptic.

"I think that ticket either way is impossible," Pelosi told a New England Cable News reporter Tuesday, pointing to comments from Clinton and her campaign that implied Republican John McCain would make a better commander-in-chief than Obama.

"I think that the Clinton administration has fairly ruled that out by proclaiming that Senator McCain would be a better commander-in-Chief than Obama," she said.

She spoke bluntly about her view that a joint ticket was not in the cards, she said, because "I wanted to be sure I didn&#39;t leave any ambiguity."

The California Democrat, who has remained neutral throughout the party&#39;s primary process, said she remains an uncommitted superdelegate.

Related: Does Clinton benefit from so-called &#39;dream ticket&#39; talk?

– CNN Associate Editor Rebecca Sinderbrand

Filed under: Nancy Pelosi

psalm34
03-11-2008, 12:58 PM
Even the House Speaker knows a joint ticket is not going to happen (http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/)

"I think that ticket either way is impossible," Pelosi told a New England Cable News reporter Tuesday, pointing to comments from Clinton and her campaign that implied Republican John McCain would make a better commander-in-chief than Obama.

"I think that the Clinton administration has fairly ruled that out by proclaiming that Senator McCain would be a better commander-in-Chief than Obama," she said.

[/b]
Yep. Galaxygirl made the same point last week. Hillary crushed any chances of that. I&#39;m glad Obama straightened things out in his speech at JSU. It was good to hear a strong response from him.....but Hillary is still ego-tripping and acting like what she said is no big deal and it could still happen!

GalaxyGirl2012
03-11-2008, 03:46 PM
Cnn grills a clinton supporter on her obama will be my VP just vote for me tactic

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/...nton.ticket.cnn (http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/2008/03/10/crowley.obama.clinton.ticket.cnn)


at a certain point doesn&#39;t it look like rendell gets the deer in the headlights look and seems as if he&#39;s this close to pulling the old"oh look it&#39;s the good year blimp" and running? :lol:

China
03-11-2008, 04:47 PM
For some reason, I&#39;ve always had a feeling that Pelosi was leaning Obama&#39;s way (though I think she really wants the strongest Democrat), but now I&#39;m really thinking that after her comment.

Sacral
03-11-2008, 04:59 PM
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com (http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/)/
Even the House Speaker knows a joint ticket is not going to happen
[/b]

Speaker Nancy Pelosi is one of the most slept on politicians in this country because many Americans don&#39;t know about House and Senate process or procedure. She&#39;s a brilliant woman who can run political circles around Hillary Clinton.

And she can do it without having a former President as her husband......Pelosi came to power on her own.

As the Speaker (and Majority Leader) of the U.S. House of Representatives, I see why she has to remain neutral as a Superdelegate. Politically she should wait until the Democratic Convention, because if she comes out as a Hillary supporter and Obama gets the Nomination, that&#39;s just more diplomatic work for her when he becomes President. And both Clinton and Obama know this.

I think she&#39;s an Obama supporter, though I haven&#39;t looked up the numbers in her California district. Clinton won the state of CA in their primary, but Pelosi has the entire House of Representatives to think about as well as her place in line if something happens to the President and Vice President.