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  1. #21
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    I'm sorry, but sometimes I think things are just a little too intellectualized (no pun intended) or analyzed. So, he called his daughters beautiful? What daughter or son wouldn't want to hear that? I'm just ...... GOOD GRIEF.
    Never Underestimate ANYONE

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  3. #22
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    Right. Too intellectualized and too ethnic are measures of intolerance for what properly sophisticated beings? Mkay, next.
    2009: Transitioned
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  4. #23
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    Yes, I'm next, too Intellectualized and too analytical for something that's so simple. I, for one, am tired of black women (and women in general) being called b##ches and h##s and it was refreshing to hear the words BEAUTIFUL and STRONG. It is what it is.
    Never Underestimate ANYONE

  5. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Serbbral View Post
    ... I, for one, am tired of black women (and women in general) being called b##ches and h##s and it was refreshing to hear the words BEAUTIFUL and STRONG. ..



    ~Love the hair you have~

  6. #25
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    The first person to tell me I was beautiful was my daddy. I was short fat dark...ugly by many other's standards, but my daddy told me I was BEAUTIFUL, his baby girl. So when fellas tried to run game...I wasn't playin' for the most part. Now I'm not saying I'm immune to some fuqqery but my daddy's voice is always in my head (I'll be 40 this coming year). When he told me I was smart and beautiful I BELIEVED him and carried that with me around the world.

    It makes a difference when a father praises his daughter, they touch us in a way mothers can't. That's my truth. Take or leave it.
    Last edited by LuvJones; 11-12-2012 at 02:14 PM.
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  7. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Serbbral View Post
    Yes, I'm next, too Intellectualized and too analytical for something that's so simple. I, for one, am tired of black women (and women in general) being called b##ches and h##s and it was refreshing to hear the words BEAUTIFUL and STRONG. It is what it is.
    Absolutely. A child needs to feel valued and loved. To be told you're beautiful/handsome by your parents is an expression of that. It's particularly true for a girl by her Father and a boy by his Mother. Every time that parent greets you with a smile, those those words or sentiments echo in your mind. It's simply a case of ongoing positive affirmation. The visual aesthetics of the child are irrelevant, of the parents ability to see the beauty in their child.

    DeBe
    Last edited by DeBe; 11-13-2012 at 03:32 PM.

  8. #27
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    Being handsome has inherently involved having nearly razor thinned hair atop a male's head with asymmetrical upkeep of the hairline, sideburns, etc. as applicable. We've had males stagger to NP and get some help with those ideals and defining their aesthetic beauty beyond those confines. Being beautiful for young females has involved long hair and/or loose curls if any. We've confronted stereotypical depictions of beauty as imposed or assimilated toward in physically and psychologically detrimental manners, as well as those distinctly popular amongst blacked folk in this country. The reinforcement of these messages have brought about a level of conformity which tow a line of mainstream beauty standards, academic indoctrination void of time and tendencies toward critical thinking, and "standards" which leave blacked young adults more readily consuming massive portions of their budget to maintain an unnatural aesthetic to continue receiving those positive affirmations.

    The Obamas have not deviated from that aesthetic assimilation uniquely imposed upon black girls. It gave me chills when they first hit the scene and it still is a concern, as far as the depiction of young black women and continued reinforcement of those values. I've never heard an elected official in the US regard his or her children as *****es or hoes. I have regarded centuries of subjugation by elected males and females who came to this world from women, have had female children of their own, and have as yet failed to reinforce a sense of self that doesn't compromise one's natural features and genuine beauty of character and its development outside of assimilation, indoctrination, and additional social conformity.

    It wasn't simple when NP was started. It wasn't simple when Oprah and Tyra were having a difficult time conveying what is natural hair to them and where their individual minds and scalps are at in that regard. When those detrimental values of femininity and the blacked aesthetic in white and male dominated society are challenged based on what is or isn't being reinforced, again, a supposed compliment and what is deemed positive comes with a mirror that compels blacked men to do better.

    I can pull up many posts and threads of black girls on NP who spoke candidly about what was being reinforced in their households and how it affected their choices as young and mature adults alike. I think, at some point (although we rarely get to have serious challenges beyond hair types) these messages and challenges extend beyond the scalp and into other areas of forced assimilation and parental prodding toward more widespread "acceptability".

    Perhaps it's too soon for Obama fanatics to take this in critically. These are two prominent young black women who are being cast within a mold that we've acknowledged on NP to be detrimental. That doesn't go away because the fellow got a nod in some other regard.
    Last edited by Intellexual; 11-13-2012 at 03:59 PM.
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  9. #28
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    @Intell. You are focusing on the physical, but I (and as far as I can see, others also) are looking beyond that to the input of a father to his child, of a public expression of a personal pride, of Daddy (on a day that is so big for him) saying for all the world to hear "of all the things in the world you are my heart, no matter what". The man has his priorities right.

    There is only one person in the world that can give a little girl that piece of life that can never fade. Her Father. The state of their hair or the fashionable perception of physical beauty, doesn't even enter that arena.

    DeBe

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  11. #29
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    I'm not. I'm noting that the inherent physical depiction, connotation, and all of the conformity to feminine values/virtues have not been discernibly challenged by the Obamas, as it pertains to presenting their daughters. We at NP may have a uniquely poignant insight into what the reinforcement of those values, including physical, can spell for a developing girl. Similar regard was noted from Romney, by myself in particular, as it pertained to his wife. This was contrasted with the substantive and glowing regard for Ryan whose wide reaching regard had everything to do with character and nothing to do with his specific gender (void of inherent context).

    When male pride, as reflected in their depiction of their wives and daughters, could rather be a self-aggrandizing statement of their own masculinity in the midst of triumph (Obama) and social grace (Romney), perhaps it serves a serious discussion of feminism and challenges to progress to not only put ethnicity into context but to also not conveniently disregard that Romney saw fit to do precisely the same thing (when contrasting how he regarded his wife versus his sons and Ryan).

    Election Day is all of ours to celebrate and reflect upon. We've all ostensibly, in this country, paid our dues and applauded another day in which the People spoke in a verifiable fashion. Yet, when the two most prominent candidates sought to regard women in their lives, there were some glaring depictions which come on the heels of serious concerns about where each stood regarding the advancement of women.

    I challenge these depictions, as I challenge male musicians who get a pass for regarding "other" women in degrading fashion yet believe they've sheltered their daughters from those ravages while contributing to the misogyny of communities and societies their daughters are being subjugating within. I don't doubt that many of those males are providing for their daughters, hugging them, and speaking to them as if they are special princesses. This is work that doesn't stop but rather comes into focus in the light of these triumphs (making it to the White House and out of "the hood").

    I've spent too much time studying these ills to put them aside because folk want to dismiss their import for one man, just as I felt a collective setback when people "sacrificed" one woman who stood up for her liberties. There's nothing which needs to be excused as the accountability does remain with us parents as well as our society. It's not about blame rather than critical analysis. If your position is that the President and no present father can do better than what has been parceled out for wives and daughters, that's fine. I don't believe we've reached perfection and impunity.

    Women have always been the majority in our country. I do not believe that women or female feminists are outdone when it comes to enabling and accepting these ills. Throughout our history, women have accepted subjugation, physical pains (beyond menstruation, childbearing, etc), and unvarnished relegation as matters of rectitude and social status. All these excuses and enabling as a testament to social grace and validation don't confuse me. This isn't new work. Many good men didn't get out of their daughters' and wives' way and women haven't getting there without men fighting with them. I do not have any reason presented to believe that the insights, ridicule, and adoration afforded as a response to these concerns are legitimately constructive. I've seen that a female majority means nothing for the advancement of women.

    I say I see something. Women say it isn't visible. I provide insight and there are reasons presented why they and I should remain blind. I'm not blind so excuses are presented for why this is actually a step forward for women. I note that we've been at this stage for a century or more. Folk blame it on partisanship. I note that Romney did the same thing. Someone says that Romney (and inherently his wife thusly) doesn't matter because he wasn't elected. McKinney, Dash, etc. No one matters. Everything is fine. All the praise of conformity is positive and all the ridicule of liberation exercising is excused.

    I know this is just talk and not serious to many people. I see by the stagnation of human rights. I see by the fervor of ridicule while any agreements tend to come with pessimism and/or indifference. I see by what gets responses and draws concern versus what folk decide to present themselves to invalidate or dismiss. I don't accept that the consequences must be so I challenge the causes and symptoms (nuanced, subconscious, and/or overt).
    Last edited by Intellexual; 11-13-2012 at 05:21 PM.
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  12. #30
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    Clearly we each translated his statement differently. I saw it as a daughter would from her Father. From first hand experience I know the impact. The impact is such, that if I could looked like the back end of a bus with all the fashionista skills of a donkey and that communication from my father through my childhood, would ensure that any man who could not see in me, the beauty my Father saw, would be relegated to shallow and not worth my time.

    I would bet my bottom dollar that Obama doesn't wait for them to be all glammed up to tell them that they're beautiful, strong and intelligent. I've no doubt he also tells/told them when they are a pile of snot and tears, hair akimbo, feeling sorry for themselves after some childhood distress or another.

    With or without NP, I'm aware of the potential negative impact of the dependance on physical beauty, I simply didn't see it in his words, combined with the spirit in which they were spoken.

    DeBe

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