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  1. #31
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    i can see both sides of the argument, but ultimately my personal opinion is that it would depend on how the individual is defining pro-black.

    if you are defining pro-black as a belief that black people should be able to have the same rights and privileges as any other humans and have the ability to chose the life they want to live and pursue their own version of happiness as they define it, then i don't think being in an interracial relationship would make a difference on being pro-black.

    if you're defining pro-black as a drive to push black people as a race up the totem pole, then interracial relationships would definitely be anti-black.

    i think this issue is pretty much the same as the feminists who look down on SAHM as if somehow those women are hurting the feminist cause. when people look at things from an individual perspective and others froma group perspective, then there will always differences and contradictions. ultimately what people are fighting for is freedom of choice and not being trapped into living your life a predetermined way because of your race, gender, religion, etc.


    @intell: regarding white people's positive contributions to the world i'm going to go with the turkey brie and grannie smith apple sandwich. that right there is the pinnacle of white civilization

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  3. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soul Rebel View Post
    I think at the bottom line heart of the matter for a lot of people is fear of the continued existence of the Black race as they know it.
    Interesting point. With the increasing rate of inter-mingling, and in some instances it appears to be encouraged over intra-mingling, it would not surprise me if that within the next 50 years or so, one would be hard pressed to find a chocolate brown black person in the United States. After a few more generations, the vast majority of black Americans could conceivably be "absorbed" into the mainstream.
    ~Love the hair you have~

  4. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soul Rebel View Post
    I think at the bottom line heart of the matter for a lot of people is fear of the continued existence of the Black race as they know it.
    I agree with this. For me, on this point, I was always neutral and now I am actively side-eyeing this concern for how many black people there will be in x amt. of years. In ancient times, people primarily identified most with their religion or culture, versus skin color. Now, that is still kinda the case, but skin color is added to the mix. What they all have in common, is it's a means to divide people at best, and cause serious harm at worst.

    It seems like perhaps we're moving towards race, culture, religion, etc. not mattering in the way is has in the past; meaning it's great to be whatever I am, but I am not going to kill/criticize anybody over it, I'm not going to only have babies with certain people to keep enough black people on the planet.

    Basically, societies evolve overtime, and making attempts to keep anything "the same" is futile. Especially when it violates other people's physical/emotional boundaries.
    BC: Spring 2000


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  6. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alecto View Post
    I know there's already been posts about this topic, but this is recent and about Tamera Mowry's baby looking too White and her white husband.
    IMHO, the criticisms are not going to achieve the desired results, which to me appear to be to make this new mother miserable about her baby.
    I recall when Tia and Tamara Mowry were first on TV, it was said that they are biracial and they were born in Germany.
    So nobody is going to tell them to stay away from relationships with Europeans.
    And that's that.

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  8. #35
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    These concerns predate her and her life is precious car accident observing bit doesn't answer to those concerns (not necessarily her skill nor social responsibility either).

    We're still a people who struggle with analyzing and untangling our republic from political partisanship and our collective allegiance to the gender binary. A great deal of socialization, legitimate science, pseudo-science, and damage has been done as we sort out the black, white, gray, etc. of these issues. When people put these serious issues into anti-intellectual lights, it's seems egocentric rather than personally resolved. The criticisms do not solely include people who disagree with the discretion and/or choices exercised. One of the things with many such non-mainstream ideals is whether or not people are as at liberty and pure in their choices.

    When the answer is to solely speak to a stacked house while objectifying the lowliest of those who consider the matter, representative of whichever ideals along a spectrum, substance is being ducked or hasn't been articulated by those who've decided to "defend themselves" rather than share wisdom or deal with the conflicting and/or intricate realities.

    Once folk try to wiggle around into their ("just leave <insert name> or <issue> alone") base, the issues themselves can get smoke bombed and that only serves to benefit the status quo. From my vantage point, the status quo isn't in the benefit of happy, healthy, and holistic living. So, I keep a critical eye on everything I can establish some consciousness and/or cognizance about.

    Also, it seems problematic to excuse someone's circumstances and/or choices from the influences of White supremacy and our kyriarchy based on how much melanin they have and/or the ethnic perception of their parentage. That's similar, to me, in some of the ills of people trying to identify with indigenous blood on this continent as if they weren't slaveholders too or those who idealize being not of that particular diaspora, as if Africans were not practicing enslavement long before the arrival of Arabs and Europeans. Whether it be the degree of one's melanin, their gender, their sexual orientation, etc., not seeking liberation and empowerment for self and others who may be lacking of it shouldn't be excused. I do agree that it also doesn't fall upon those identifying with disenfranchised people to fight the fight and walk what they talk in particular. I rather think it is the responsibility of any and all persons at liberty. Equal opportunity, equal responsibility per power, and equal accountability per (in)action.

    It's a problem that our White brothers and sisters excuse themselves from the liberation of blacked people so long as they "try" to get someone black a merit based promotion at work or concede to the problematic nature of non-blacked people using the "N' word. Fathers shouldn't get extra credit for fathering within the idealized family model and whites shouldn't get credit for not being overt racists. Likewise, no human should get extra credit for not being an indifferent self-absorbed leech.

    While I believe in the healing power of love, I do recognize that there are very misguided efforts to annihilate Whites and Blacked people (that's not to downplay the tough and misguided fight going on to limit/control Hispanics). Say I were in a country doing sex-selective abortions and I grandstanded against the least disciplined of people expressing curiosity and/or opinions (as if speaking to them speaks intelligently to the matters themselves). Then, I go off and try to portray being above it all by saying that I saw a vehicular accident and it really put a focus on the fragility of life and what's really important. Um...have any of you read letters from some more indignant and dignified anti-abolitionists? I've seen stories just like that of people holding onto their elitism.

    Granted, in spite of the poor form shown and it speaking to immaturity which was present when she was making her choices of who to marry and have child with (let's not pretend people haven't made phucked up "permanent" choices before they became conscious, went natural, etc.), I'm not some hypocrite who feels my position should be framed around her ineptitude. She's, as we're all, entitled to her opinion but I think framing my conclusion around her is a bad, bad idea. She's grandstanding and playing to a home crowd. She doesn't resolve the matters for the society nor speak to everything that's right and/or wrong in those regards.

    I think a dialogue of the sort is much healthier when people utilize critical thinking skills which draw from a case, engage in creative and critical analysis, and then go back to the story (unpause the video, read the next chapter) or observe the behaviors for further consideration of what happened or happens beyond one's own ideals, thoughts, and determination. Ultimately, as noted, any anti-intellectual postures promote a dumbing down of the People, allegiance to the status quo, and/or defenselessness of a non-thinking populous. If we discuss these without playing up ego, we can help others learn and inform their own decisions outside of the indoctrination vessels of public, parochial, and higher education paradigms.
    Last edited by Intellexual; 02-17-2013 at 04:53 AM.
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  9. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alecto View Post
    I know there's already been posts about this topic, but this is recent and about Tamera Mowry's baby looking too White and her white husband.

    http://www.clutchmagonline.com/2013/...ds-skin-color/




    Really interesting comments. Here's a few:






    Retort:




    There's so much more in the comments and I find them more interesting than the article. If you have a relationship/marriage/kids with a non-Black person, are you less "pro-Black" than someone who has these with a Black person? Why should your be seen as being less passionate about issues affecting Black people?
    First - The child is 3/4 European descent how do people expect the baby to look? If the baby was 3/4 African heritage like a lot of us are would folks expect such black people to look blonder and blue eyed and flat straight hair?

    Second - there are black people who exist with black partners who could not give two figs about 'problack' issues. Whether folks are pro black or not the heritage of their partners is whose business exactly?
    Last edited by Denny; 03-01-2013 at 03:46 PM.
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  10. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by MommieDearest View Post
    Interesting point. With the increasing rate of inter-mingling, and in some instances it appears to be encouraged over intra-mingling, it would not surprise me if that within the next 50 years or so, one would be hard pressed to find a chocolate brown black person in the United States. After a few more generations, the vast majority of black Americans could conceivably be "absorbed" into the mainstream.
    The UK already has that situation, the mixed race ethnic group is the fastest growing and outstrips the Black Caribbean and Black African groups (but not when their numbers are added together). Such things used to bother me but no one ethnic group has a divine right to exist, so if the British Black community wants to 'breed' itself out of existence so be it is my pov these days.
    Black men raised in black households by black women intermarry in larger ratios than any other ethnic group...... I call that irony.
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  11. #38
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    At what point CAN these bi-racial people cross over to white?
    Instigating and waiting for the REVOLUTION to begin!

  12. #39
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    Unfortunately the rules we've created for what race someone belongs to are arbitrary and not based on anything concrete. Someone considered black in America or the UK, might be considered white in Cuba or Brazil or somewhere else. It's all kinda dumb, really. But it is, what it is.
    BC: Spring 2000


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    Quote Originally Posted by Padme32 View Post
    Unfortunately the rules we've created for what race someone belongs to are arbitrary and not based on anything concrete. Someone considered black in America or the UK, might be considered white in Cuba or Brazil or somewhere else. It's all kinda dumb, really. But it is, what it is.
    Padme,something that has always bothered me about the whole biracial conversation is that no one in that situation seems to want to explore "being white" and that seems protectionist of the racist definition of white. Consider that I can't see any group that I am apart of that my children CAN'T be.

    It actually seems "racist" that the focus is always on what Blacks feel about biracials and yet it never seems to challenge the definition of white.

    It seems if the children of whites DEMANDED inclusion it would revolutionize everything in AMERICA and then AMERICA could truly evolve....
    Instigating and waiting for the REVOLUTION to begin!

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